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Hair Removal Methods Professional Electrolysis
#21

I have already thought this through in detail before starting this thread hence I am confident that it is feasible.

I know James is currently off line but I have sent him a private message so that he is aware of this thread and can add his bit when he has the time.

I was unsure about interest from my UK friends but I am pleased to see everyone has warmed to the idea.

The cost of the flight and accommodation will obviously become cheaper if more people are involved because it will be absorbed by more people so this is not the issue.

The slight “difficulty” will be coordinating it so that every one is able to receive the individual treatment they require. So for example, someone requires 2 full days of James’ time and someone else only requires 2 hours, the person that requires only 2 hours will be absorbing additional accommodation costs that s/he is not deriving benefit from. This is the bit that will require a little thought and planning to ensure everyone gets the most out of this arrangement.

The other factor to consider is that James will have his US clients and I imagine he is in high demand. So it will be essential to have a timetable, probably for a couple 6 month stretch, so that James can manage his time, although we will need James input to create this.

All things considered, I think this is the most effective may for people in the UK to receive the best possible treatment.

All the comments you are making are positive and please keep the interest coming. As soon as James adds his bit, and hopefully he will be interested, I will start getting the ball moving.

Thank you.

#22

It costs a lot more than just a plane ticket to fly over expensive electrolysis equipment. not to mention the work hours we would have to reimburse for time spent packing it all up and in travelling.

#23

that’s true… but James will be able to advise on exactly what is required in that respect… at the moment you are only speculating (negatively) :slight_smile:

#24

Right now, I pay £55/hour and my electrologist does about 300 hairs an hour with blend. About 600 with thermolysis, although I would not undergo such a long session of thermolysis with the old tech. I believe James can do about 700 hairs an hour, with of course, the addition of many hours at once and no longer term reaction. So I think it would have to cost no more than about £100 an hour or so to make it feasible from my pov.

It’s part of my job to source out potential problems, find solutions and decide whether projects are worth pursuing or not. So I see everything with “convince me that this is worth it” eyes.

#25

I fully understand and I’m on the same page… although I would personally be prepared to pay more than £100 per hour for James.

Let’s wait for James to join before dismissing the idea and pointing out all the problems. If we can get enough interest, and the costs are still a bit high, if I am able to “fill the gap” I will do so myself.

#26

I’m not dismissing it, I’m just mentioning things to consider.

Periodicity is still an issue. James would have to come back every 6-8 weeks. And if he’s treating 10-20 patients, that would be for anywhere from 1 to 2 weeks, so I’m not sure how that would fit in with his US schedule. Yes, I know this is for James to address.

Do you know how much James charges in the US? I’m sure you do.

I do and I have done my costing to go there, so I would not be prepared to pay that much more than the combined cost of that for the same treatment in the UK. And if it’s a city other than London, that would also be another thing for me to consider.

I’m also looking at going to Malaga for body work although I haven’t discussed this with depi yet as I’m currently too busy for the near future but that would work out very reasonable cost wise.

#27

This is interesting. In case you’re wondering, it would be a lot cheaper to fly in the off-season (basically when the weather is crap in the UK, which is often :slight_smile: and outside of any major US holidays…generally early mid-Oct to mid-Nov and mid-Feb to mid-April is pretty cheap…as cheap as $400 r/t).

#28

Hmmm… I’ve been skimming the UK work permit regs for non-EU folks. If I’m reading it correctly, there’s a non-refundable application fee of £690 for non-sponsored highly skilled workers - and they aren’t guaranteed to be approved. That’s a big ouch if that was per visit. There’s also a cap on the number of applications that will be approved.

Secondly, I’m pretty sure US 110V equipment won’t have CE approval - would it be lawful to use it professionally in the UK? If not, then an Apilus Platinum (or similar) would add £4-5000 to the initial costs.

Thirdly, HM Revenue and Customs. A working US citizen would have to file income tax returns here, or pay an accountant to do so (more expense).

Finally, insurance. Would they have/want professional liability insurance? If so would what they currently have cover them in the UK? Would this be yet more expense?

As I see it, it’d be a hell of a lot simpler (and cheaper) for the UK clients to go to the 'States on visa waiver to see an electrologist, than to try to bring the US electrologist here.

#29

Holy bureaucracy crap, Batman!!!

James just called me to say he is aware of this discussion. He asked me to pass on to all of you that he is without internet access as he has been traveling in his Jamesmobile through South Carolina, Georgia, New Jersey, (did I miss a couple states?) and tomorrow it’s Pennsylvania!! He will respond to all in the next 48 hours when he gets home.

Dee (James’ secretary in a pinch extraordinaire!)

#30

Tori T,

With regards work permits, I think this would fall under “Tier 2 (General)” because James would effectively be sponsored if he were to come. We would need to clarify with the UK Border Agency but I think a permit would be valid for 3 years. Please can you paste a link to the “non refundable fee of £690” because I was not aware of it and don’t think it applies to sponsored work.

Can’t you just use a converter plug (or something similar) on US equipment so that it works in the UK? I know that the Apilus Platinum is a bit more advanced than the I-POD docking station I bought from the states but a converter plug did the trick. Hopefully James can advise, otherwise we would need to check with the manufacturer.

Income tax returns etc - I can take care of that for free.

Professional liability insurance - probably not automatically covered for the UK, however I doubt it would cost much to incorporate into his existing policy. Also, I don’t think liability insurance its mandatory however one would expect to sign a document saying that treatment is at his/her own risk.

#31

concerned129, I think we should not be fixed on one electrologist. I know James works the fastest etc. but it would be just as good for us UK people to have Dee or depilacionelectr. I don’t mind going to Spain (you have to see her pictures, they prove she has got the skills too) but I can’t travel alone and no one will come with me right now. Also it would work out way cheaper. But as you guys are doing already, try to work out the costs of everything first and if our US electrologist will work out too expensive, we can always go onto the next area.

I too don’t mind paying more per hour to have James or anyone else come over because we know their works is faster and less painful so the first point is already a massive bonus because in the long term that could work out cheaper. So paying more is not a problem. I wouldn’t go abroad alone so I guess I don’t mind if it costs more to come here either, but we’d have to see. The more people we get the better, but then that would affect treatment times but we could work out the ratio of all that.

I hope we can work out a way some way or another.

#32

Hi peace1 - I agree that we should explore and evaluate all options. My personal preference would be to come to an arrangement with James, simply because even without meeting him in person I feel 100% confident in his ability.

I think that one should be prepared to pay a marginally higher rate for his services simply because I expect them to be superior. However, I am keen to come to an agreement that is mutually beneficial for all parties concerned. So, for James it would have to be worth his while to come to the UK and for us it would need to be affordable and a better option than travelling individually.

At this point we really must wait for James to join the discussion but rest assured, I will do my utmost to work something out.

#33

When or if James comes to the UK, if there are any electrologists that would care to have a little seminar with him and observe what he does, this would benefit all of you. There is no doubt in my mind, that electrologists in the UK have the ability to perform excellent electrolysis care. If you feel something is lacking in your electrolysis care, perhaps it is, but it is correctable. If other electrologists are curious to learn beyond what they are now doing, then they will be the ones that will welcome James with a warm hug and an open mind. As for me, I do not like to travel because of too many obligations on the home front and with my business. I’m thinking that would be the case for many of you, thus, I say again, it would be prudent to convince your electrologists to meet James and observe what he does so well, so they can conveniently take over and serve all of you with new technology, speed and efficacy.

Many professions are in group think mode. This is true for electrologists as well. If one electrologist purchases a Sterex epilator, most others will follow, especially if they are graduating students. Thinking beyond what everyone else does is vital. Heck, maybe all of you can can become electrologists and change the world of hair removal in the UK.

#34

Ladies and gentlemen, this thread proves the adage that your cell phone doesn’t drop a call until the worst possible moment. It is like you were just asked to marry someone, but the call was fading, so you did not hear it, and tried to say, “I can’t hear you”, but all the proposer heard was, “I can’t” <Click> and thinks you hung up.

I have been out working on a slew of out of town clients, and thanks to a broken laptop, did not even have net access in the few places where I might have been able to sign on, had I had one with me.

So, it looks like I have been ignoring this thread, when I have just not been here.

I don’t have much time to talk now, but I can tell you this much; If the costs were spread between people, this could work no matter what practitioner you choose. The costs are just the shipping of the equipment (unless someone in the country where we would meet has the same equipment) plus the air fares. The cost of the accommodations can be lessened if someone is able to host the practitioner (assuming the chosen practitioner is willing to accept the spare bedroom, or guest house as the case may be).

Most of my clients are on a once every 6 weeks full clearance schedule until they have so few hairs coming in that they fall off to 8 or 12 weeks in between work.

Having said all this, allow me to say that although I have not seen the work of the UK practitioners, I am sure they are getting some good work done. They may not have the speed you have seen demonstrated here, but they are getting the hair permanently removed, just the same.

I would advise that if someone were to be brought over, it would be best if those who wanted to learn from the experience had the opportunity to have a seminar where a pick up course in this style of work were taught. Of course, this assumes that the practitioner chosen were willing to do this.

Needless to say, if I were the practitioner making the trip, I would gladly go the extra mile on these points. My friends in Spain want me to do the same thing for them as well. (Since three people in Spain have hands on experience with me, they have shown the benefits to others already) The problem has been the same, how to organize the interested practitioners into making it happen that the person who they want to give the seminar actually shows up and they all get to have the benefit of that experience.

I wish you luck, as I have heard this kind of thing frequently, and it rarely happens, due to lack of organization, and/or people shying away from actually chipping in when it is time to put in their part on making it all come together. Of course, when it does come together, it is a beautiful thing.

I hope this helps you all.

#35

It would definitely be a lot cheaper to you all to fly to Spain once every 6 weeks to see Josefa who participates on this forum and also uses Apilus. With all the low cost carriers in Europe, it could be as little as $20-40 per flight. I’ve done it when I lived in Europe. And you can stay at hostels and guesthouse for $25-35 per night if you’re not going at the same time and sharing a hotel room. Spain is a lot cheaper than the UK.

#36

Hi James,

It’s great to hear from you.

I am all for this (and my sister would be) if the hourly cost is reasonable and we don’t spend more than if we were to travel to you.

I know my electrologist would be very keen to attend a seminar and I’m sure she could convince the salon owner (an electrologist) and the other 2 electrologists who work at the same salon to attend. More than being treated myself by yourself, I would very, very much like this to happen so that these electrologists can see your work first hand and the difference it can make to the level of treatment offered. This salon does great work in every other respect and if they were to get in new technology and train up on it, it really would make such a huge difference to electrolysis in London and the UK.

My electrologist was telling me some time back that an electrologist from the US was supposed to come over for a special BIAE seminar on the Apilus technology but due to the ash cloud it was cancelled. She was booked to attend this, so I’m certain she would jump at the chance to attend a seminar by you.

#37

I agree LAgirl. My sister and I are planning on going to Josefa in the future for body work . Total costs are very reasonable. It seems to me that the problem people seem to have is with the travel.

#38

i wish i lived in the UK i would Definantly be in on this, suxs im ‘down under’

#39

The £690 applies to Tier 1 applications (which I assumed would be the tier applied under), Tier 2 is about half that.

A Tier 2 application is a whole other bag’o’worms. We, the sponsors, have to be licensed by the UK Border Agency. In order to get that license we have to prove to them we are a legally recognised company/charity/religious org/educational establishment.

In order to get someone here, we have to formally offer them a job, with a job title, job description, skills/qualifications/experience requirements, a location, a remuneration package, etc., etc.

However, we must first offer the job to UK residents for 28 days in the Job Centres and national/professional publications. If anyone applies, we must show good reasons why they’re not suitable.

The qualifications of the job have to be equivalent or greater than NVQ/SVQ 3 before a foreign national can be sponsored for it.

Only then can we start to bring someone over, and that person still has all the UKBA eligibility hoops to jump through.

If we finally get them here, we have to keep copies of their passport, and comply with all the other data protection and immigration fluff that employers have to.

I just checked. The Apilus Platinum Pure boasts a universal intelligent PSU on the manufacturers website, so that would be fine. The other models… I don’t know, it doesn’t say.

#40

Hello James… welcome to the thread… your contribution has been eagerly awaited.

It would be great if you could hold seminars for UK practitioners however in my opinion if a UK practitioner really wanted to learn and improve, the onus should fall on them to at the very least facilitate the process.

The other thing is, without speaking on behalf of my friends that contributed on this thread, I would prefer to be treated by you, rather than someone who has attended your seminar and still has the learning curve.

I really want to arrange for you to come to London (if of course you are in favour of the idea) so that you can work on myself and the ladies/gentlemen that have shown interest on this forum.

If at the same time you are able to teach local practitioners that would be great, but I would personally feel more comfortable with you doing the work.

I know this is not going to be easy to arrange but it is definitely possible. I would like to facilitate this to make it happen and hope that everyone who has contributed is okay with this. I want to stress at this point that I have no intention to profit (other than to receive my treatment from James) everything will be completely transparent. I am also prepared to contribute more financially to ensure this happens (provided within reason) however I will obviously need the help of everyone here.

So far I have the following questions:

  1. Equipment : James you said that you need to ship the equipment. I am assuming you have more than one device otherwise you will have a problem working while your equipment is in transit. Please clarify.

  2. Permits : This looks like its going to be a pain in the arse. James, have you encountered similar issues when working overseas and are you familiar with the process?

  3. Schedule of treatments : To be compiled when points 1 & 2 have been clarified and proven feasible.

  4. Costs : This can be addressed when we can send you a combined treatment schedule. You can advise the time and cost of treatments and we can then calculate the total cost and apportion it accordingly.

  5. Dates/Times : To be addressed when points 3 & 4 have been calculated.

I know the idea of travelling to Spain keeps coming up however I am very much in favour of being treated by James for at least the first couple of clearances, and if possible the whole thing.

I will wait for James’ feedback on points 1 & 2 and any other comments and thoughts that people have. Please try and mention anything on your mind including concerns, ideas, things that have not been mentioned etc etc etc.

On Tue 27th July, once every has raised their points, I will start to structure this tread so that we can make the arrangements. I hope everyone is on board because it will require commitment from all of us, especially at the beginning!!

On a final note… THANK YOU James for taking this seriously I lets hope this is one of those times when everything falls into place.

The other option would be for James to just re-locate to the UK permanently…