laser sucess on Indian Skin

Hair Removal Methods Laser hair removal
#1

Hello Everyone,

I have had a bad experience with and ILP machine at the laser center that operates out of the UCLA medical office. I had one treatment on my face only to have the hair come back VERY coarse and dark. I was recommended to electrology a year ago on this fourm and have had GREAT RESULTS.

Now I am interested in doing laser on my legs and entire bakini/brazilian bikini area. Although I am indian I have light skin (type III or lighter even but my face is four) on my legs and the hair is dark on the lower legs and coarse. So dark that even after shaving I have pepper spots galore that stick out at least 2mm. I can never get a close shave. The bikini area I have very very thick and dark too…After I shave it looks almost like a mans 5 o’clock shadow. From what I have read from the forum it looks like laser may be a good option for me.

My concern though it that form what I have read and heard from other stores, Indian women seem to make up a good number of those people on whom laser actually made the hair DARKER AND COARSER. Does that seem like the trend, or is it just me? Is Indian skin just have a higher chance of being less responsive to laser and causing increase in hair growth, darkness, coarseness?

Also, does anyone have any reccomnadtions as to what might be a good option for me?

Are there any indian women out here that have had good results in doing these areas with laser. I have read on the forum that yag is the best for us 6-8 weeks apart for each session.

Also, does anyone know a good laser technition in southern California that is experienced with treating indian skin?

Any guidance would be appreciated greatly! ; )

Thank you!

#2

Welcome back. Thanks for an update. You may want to post your electrolysis story on the electrolysis section of this forum. It will help a lot of people, especially if you provide an electrologist recommendation.

In terms of your current situation, you are right and laser is a great option for these areas.

A couple things:

  • Since you’re Indian, you’re at least a type IV, even if you look light. There is underlying pigment due to your ethnic background. Thus, you need a Yag laser. GentleYAG and Coolglide machines are popular.

  • There is no induced growth issues on the areas you’re asking about. That issue for women with your background is only on the face, and also always ONLY on fine hair. Laser works great on coarse hair like bikini that you describe. And it’s exactly the type of hair that laser should be used for.

  • Laser treatments should be done 8-12 weeks apart on those areas. Legs have long hair cycles, so after a few treatments, you would even be doing every 16 weeks or so.

  • I know of clinics in LA that have a Yag laser, but I don’t know how good they are. The best thing for you to do is to strt having consultations with places that have a Yag laser. Ask them questions and determine which have your best interests in mind and know what they’re doing. Start by going to Candela Corporation website and doing a provider search for a clinic with GentleYAG laser using your zip code. There will be a number of options you can start with.

#3

Thank You so much for your reply.

I have one more question though. I would like to do the entire brazillan wax area so to speak or the pubic area. The skin there is of very akward pigmentation …almost purpuleish. Do you know if laser would work on that type of skin. The skin is like that on my knees as well.

Also, what do I do about the areas on my upper tighs that are mixed with coarse and fine hair?

Thanks

#4

A Yag laser is best for darker skin. It can even be used on african american skin, so just find someone who knows what they’re doing, with this type of laser, and you’ll be fine.

It’s fine to treat your upper thighs. It will reduce the density and some finer hair will just be left once you’re done, that you can decide to finish with electrolysis if you want a complete clearance.

#5

In sorry. Im not sure I understood correctly. Do you mean that if I were to treat the upper thigh area which has dark hair that is FINE in texture, it will NOT result is laser induced growth nd/or coarser hair growth?

If thats the case, then why does fine dark hair on the face become coarse?

Sorry, just a bit confused. I just want to be informed when I go in for a consultation so I decipher if the technition is knowalgebale or not.

Thanks

#6

Hi again,

So I have decided that I would like to get laser done on my under arms , full legs, and full bikini area. with my type 4 indian skin and mix of coarse and thin black hair on my upper legs, the toughest and most crucial part is going to be finding the right person/ clinic to do it.

Today I made some calls and this what I found:

  1. At Megan Medical clinic in Covina CA a nurse and Dr. working together. They use the CoolGlide Yag 1064 she said and have only been in laser for two years. I have a consult with her firday and I will update then.

  2. After searching the Candela and cutra site I found some places but I was not comfortable getting a consult form a simple consultant then having a tech/nurse work on me.

3.I also called a place reccmneded by Indian friends who had laser done on legs, arms, etc. It’s called Solaris in Encino ca. They said “Oh we have tons of experience with indian skin…we use a GenteLase etc,” which I know is an aexandrite which I uderstand is NOT good for my skin tone. That leads me to believe that they really dont have my best interest in mind. But the lasy said she did it her own dark skin and it wroked well.

Im looking forward to my appt. on firday an I’ll update everyone then.

If anyone cam make a recommendations of a knowledgeable places anywhere in the SoCal area that have been using yag with at least two years experince or have experince with dark skin please please let me know! I would like to consult with at least one or two more places but I am having a hard time finding them. And the practitioner is the most important part of success with laser.

Also what should I expect to happen to the finer hairs on my upper thighs? Should I even treat them at all?

Anny suggestion would be helpful. The process in finding someone is really difficult and Im strating to gte bit dicouraged after making so many calls and not finding many people.

Thanks

#7

That’s the unfortunate thing about any form of permanent hair removal, finding a decent practitoner. It does sound a bit pre-packaged to have someone giving you a consultation then a nurse/doctor doing the treatment. However, it doesn’t hurt to see what it’s like, if it’s free what’s the harm eh?

The Coolglide isn’t a bad nd:YAG, not as good as others such as the GentleYAG and Cynosure Elite but people still can get some good results if treated properly. See how the consultation goes eh?

I have to admit, it sounds a little odd using a GentleLASE on Type 4 skin, when I was chatting to my current practitioner she was telling me how she tried lowering the pulse to 10 when treating herself with the nd:YAG (she has around a skin type 4 to 5, with this skin type the pulse should be used very carefully if below 40) and found she got a large amount of irritation afterwards, and the GentleLASE has a pulse of 3. She also mentioned about how she tried treating herself with the Alexanderlite and found she got hyperpigmentation, so I’d be wary about that one, but of course this is the Internet so no one can say for sure. Does your friend have the same skin type as you? Same level of coarseness (I know you may not know, but hey might as well ask)? Is it possible if you could find out what settings were used?

Laser induced hair growth is most likely to occur on a woman’s face than any other area on her body, however there have been posted from women who have found it else where. If the hair is dark and dense and not to thin (as in you can see it clearly in normal light, not just direct sunlight) the risk is not as high, however it doesn’t mean it is non-existant.

Don’t give up, just keep looking! Hey, I have to do an all round 4 hour journey to go to get my laser done and that’s on the train, let alone car.

Regards,
Benji

#8

Induced growth is only an issue on the face for women. It’s a hormonal thing. No concrete proof yet as research is still out on this, but plenty of anecdotal evidence on these forums and some initial studies.

I’m not sure what you mean by not wanting to do consults at any places listed on the provider searches. How do you know how each place operates and who you get to consult with, and who does your treatment? You would need to call each one to find out. It’s not necessary and actually sometimes worse to get treated by a physician, as they are the ones who usually don’t do hair removal 24/7 (they usually have other medical commitments). A technician who’s been operating the same machine for years would have a lot more experience.

My friend is getting treated by Dr Rosenbach in Beverly Hills. I believe he has an Apogee Elite machine, which is both alex and a Yag. Can’t recommend them one way or another since she just started. LaserAway is inexpensive and they have an Apogee Elite as well. They seem to be ok, but a male on this forum was concerned that they were missing some areas.

#9

Thank you so much for all your replies and guidance.

I’ve been making phone calls all day and I have two appointments with centers for consultations. One uses a gentalYAG and has 5yrs experience the other the CoolGlide with two years experience.

What makes the Genteal better? and how much emphasis should I put on the genteal vs coosglide when choosing a practitioner?

I’ll be able to elaborate more on fiday about the other differences between the two practitioners when I for my consult. I cant wait!

#10

Read through the questions we recommend you ask at your consultation. It would also help if you can ask what settings they’re planning to use, including joules, spot size, and pulse, on you. You should be able to tell who is better for you through your consultations.

Both of these machines are pretty good. GentleYAG has a bigger spot size, so that’s an advantage (18mm and biggest on the market). But experience is very important, as all settings are variable and they need to know how to use them.

My friend recently went to Dr Rosenbach. He uses Apogee Elite machine that is both a Yag and an Alex. I can’t recommend him yet since she only had one treatment so far. However, one plus is that you only pay per treatment there, so you’re not stuck in a contract if you decide to switch. I personally prefer an option like this, or a refund option if I choose to switch.

#11

Read through the questions we recommend you ask at your consultation. It would also help if you can ask what settings they’re planning to use, including joules, spot size, and pulse, on you. You should be able to tell who is better for you through your consultations.

Both of these machines are pretty good. GentleYAG has a bigger spot size, so that’s an advantage (18mm and biggest on the market). But experience is very important, as all settings are variable and they need to know how to use them.

My friend recently went to Dr Rosenbach. He uses Apogee Elite machine that is both a Yag and an Alex. I can’t recommend him yet since she only had one treatment so far. However, one plus is that you only pay per treatment there, so you’re not stuck in a contract if you decide to switch. I personally prefer an option like this, or a refund option if I choose to switch.

#12

Friday I had my first two consultations . Both places had their pros and cons. I wish I could make a hybrid of the two places. Here is the answers I got for my questions ……

Skin: is type four (South Asian), coarse black hair, some fine on arms
Areas: Full bikini, full legs, underarms, maybe arms if Im a good candidate.

  1. Dr. Ella Fedonenko in LA on Wilshire:
    Machine: Candella GentleYAG
    Settings: To be safe she will treat me with settings for type V skin. START with 18mm spot size, freq 12-14, pulse of 3ms then go up accordingly. She looked at the Candella booklet to reference these settings.
    Experience: Four years
    The office: The Dr. who consulted with me will perform all laser procedures, she is a general practitioner, but she as a little spa in her office with massages, laser, and other stuff.
    Have you seen any laser induced growth on your patients: “no, not even on the face. Most of my clients are very happy. For some, when he hair gets too thin I do stop telling them to come in and try alternatives like electrolysis.”
    Time intervals: “I want to see you every four weeks, if there is no growth longer” I told her than that seemed too short and she insisted that it as perfect.
    How any sessions will I need: At every four weeks anywhere form 4-8 to get 70-80% reduction.
    Pricing: Package of 5 treatments on all the above mentioned areas approx 2500$ with pay as you go. Can cancel in between. Willing to price match.
    Hours and distance: further than place 2 but I can manage.

I’m not concerned with price right now at all. I am looking for experienced practitioners and results. Overall I was comfortable with her. She seems like she was experienced and interested in my results. But the fact that she recommends four week intervals leads me to think maybe she might not experienced because from this fourm I know its supposed ot be longer than that. She also said that I should shed in a few days. She was very forth coming with information. Seemed interested in my results.

  1. Magan Laser Clinic in Covina CA
    Machine: Cutera Cool Glide YAG
    Settings: to START 40J, 10mm spot size, pulse width 20
    Experience: the nurse practitioner that consulted with me will perform all the procedures. She has 2.5 years experience. Does about 10-15 ppl per week.
    Goal: 70-90% reduction over 5-7 treatments spaced 6 weeks apart. She said, “If you dont have growth please call me and cancel you appointment” Will take one week to shed. Well over one week to see full shedding. After about 2-3 treatments would like me to grow out the hair to see what the progress is like.
    Side effects: will experience about a level 5 on scale form 1-10 due to density of hair. You may have red/swollen looking follicles for the first few hours and warm skin. There are rare but there is a risk of burning and burns can sometimes lead to infecton. “Im not trying to scar you . I just want you to be aware of the possibilities” she said.
    Have you seen laser induced growth or laser not workining: on one woman’s jaw line and side burns. On one woman ILP did not work at all on her Bikini but she did not have darker growth.
    Have you seen any burns: one person blistered.
    Packages: comparable to place one. Pay as you go….can cancel anytime. But again, prince is not my concern. I just want results.
    Hours: Work very well with my schedule and close to home.

Overall, the place was nice, very professional because it’s a huge clinic adjacent to a medical office. Lots of different laser procedures there. As soon as I went in she started telling me about all the potential side effects etc. and was very forth coming with information. Explained to me that this was a dr’s office and they are very concerned with their patients. The prices were much higher but they were willing to work with me so Im getting the price I want. But again….price is not my determining factor….im more concerned with results.

So what do you guys think of these two places? What do you guys think are the pros and cons of each? Im not really sure what to do from here…how to decide what might be best for me. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!

Also, here is a link to my upper arms. Im not sure if the hair on my arms is too thin of not. If its too thin perhaps I should get treated with an a alex on them. Im am very scared of laser induced growth in this area. However, it is my understanding that this is only an occurrence in male arms and the female face.

Thanks

#13

hi girlwithhope,

I am Indian and have successful and some not so good treatments with laser.
I started off with full legs on the ND Yag. I have very light asian skin but dark coarse hairs on the legs - like yous ay with pepper spots and couldn’t wear a skirt without coloured tights!

I saw a great reduction in the coarse hairs - in fact the lower legs now have about 10% hairs on them, kinda fine and light but need to shave them off ebery week or so…
The upper thighs not so good, yep all the darkers hairs have kinda gone, but still have a lot of finer but still dark in terms of asian hair (like upper arms) on some parts of thighs and the back.

I did 6 sessions of the nd yag but i never saw the same nurse and nobody changed settings - but still the hair was a lot lot less.
I then did 6 more with the apogee which i think is a yag as well but the nurses were great with settings and now got the lower leg hair down to sparse and fine.

The only problem is the upper leg hairs and my KNEES - not one of the hairs responded there so have awful dark hairs to remind me how they were before!

I’ve also had about 8 - 10 treatments on the face - it was finer hair and had an inkling it wouldn’t really work -but now we have changed to a different pulse altogether - i think a shorter one than is normally used and was ok’d by the doctor there…
so fingers crossed…

I’m also now having the underarms and bikini line done - wow, the shedding after that is amazing - no hairs at all -but still my first treatment but my follow up is in 2 weeks and no signs of hairs as yet.

I would def, suggest six weeks at least…

What I found is in between those 6-8 weeks my hair came back, but only a little…
When I didn’t have treatments or longer breaks and let it grow out after the shedding phase, saw there was a lot of it still there!

Also having my arms done, (6 treatments so far) mixed results there too -dark coarse hairs going, finer not…

I don’t have blond hairs, just finer hair upper arms…
I hope the newer settings help…

Setting wise, on nearly all have always worked up to the highest setting for the apogee as tolerate it well so the nurses do think well, no redness isn’t a good sign!!

ps the bikini line didn’t even hurt - infact my upper lip and face kills more!!

(PS anyone reading who knows more about this fine hair and how to target it, please let me know- i’ve spent a FORTUNE on laser hair removal, but wanna just carry on and get rid of the majority of it all now that i’ve started!!)

#14

  • Laser most likely won’t work on your finer hair, especially on the face. I would switch to electrolysis for those areas right away to avoid wasting money.

  • You need to wait longer between treatments. Legs need at least 12-14 weeks. Bikini and underarms, at least 8-10. As mentioned, I think you need to stop treating your face with laser.

  • What settings are being used on you now? Can you find out the spot size, joules, and pulse?

  • If the treatment doesn’t hurt, it’s a good sign that the hair is too fine and/or the settings are too low. That also means that the hair may not be killed even if it shed. It’s very important to treat at high enough settings to actually affect the hair permanently.

#15

quick question …

after my post on my two consultations(posted 3/16)two-three people including LAgril responded. following those responses, I posted three more pictures and received another response form LAgirl.I was wondering why those posts and responses have been removed and if there is any way to retrieve them? those responses were very helpful and inluded feedback that I was going to use to base my decision of which practitioner to use ans areas to treat.

#16

There was a glitch on the site yesterday and they dissappeared. Haven’t heard back from Andrea if there is a way to get them restored.

If they don’t reappear, let me know what kind of information you don’t remember from what I posted.

#17

lagirl,

I’m really interested about your comment about it not hurting.
I will find out the settings, but was on an apogee yag - am now on a smaller spot size, I think 12mm to target the finer hairs. Am on the highest setting possible for the apogee - have built up to this slowly as only allowed to go up one at a time, but as i have so many areas done, I normally start on the 2nd highest setting. (this is the one i had on the bikini line and underarms)

yes, it hurts as in is painful, but can tolerate it as the air kinda numbs it a little.
very rarely is the area red - my lower arms have been and when i first had laser used to get red dots for hours and redness but now i hardly get a red tint.
i always wondered why, but i thought i built up a tolerance!!

Ahh, really that much time in between? I was told i needed to have it regularly - i did leave treatments for 2/3 months for my legs but then was told for better results have it 6- 8 weeks.

i can always phone in and change the appointment to when i want though… will try longer intervals then - I do find by the time i go the appointment ie for my arms, i havent had a full arm of hairy hair back, just patches…

ps i will look into electrolysis - always thought this was very time consuming - i have thinner hair but a lot of it all over my face ie when i bleach, can see it. would take forever?

#18

  • There are 3 variables when setting the settings. There is no way for it to be “highest” or “second highest” the way you describe as this is subjective. It can be high joules, but very long pulse, or very low joules and short pulse, etc. In general, the follicles are usually red for at least some time and often raised if the treatment for effective. And there is full shedding of all treated hairs. It sounds like they’re not using the right settings at this point.

  • Laser is attracted to pigment. Waiting only 6 weeks basically doesn’t let the new hair fully develop yet. Most of it either is not there yet or is too fine and thin for laser to target. It’s in your best interests to wait a bit longer. Otherwise, you basically end up having more treatments in the long run.

  • Patchiness is a sign of missed spots. You may want to ask them to overlap the area better.

  • Laser doesn’t work on finer hair, especially on a woman’s face. Electrolysis treats hairs one by one, so each treatment is not as fast as laser. However, it’s the ONLY method that can remove this type of hair permanently. So you don’t have other options if you want it gone. You can keep retreating this hair with laser and paying for it, and nothing will happen. I would spend that money on professional electrolysis. Good electrologists with good equipment are fast and can get you results in the same time overall as laser, about 12 months. You’ll just need more treatments during that time. But you’ll actually get results for your money. The most important thing with electrolysis is going in on schedule. Unlike with laser, you need to get a clearance quickly and then come in as soon as you see new hair pop up. It’s easiest to kill hair with electrolysis when it’s new and still weak. Please read the electrolysis section of this forum for more info.

#19

MY first treatemnt,

I decided to go to a place called magan clinic in West Covina california. I am very disspointed in the missed spots. I keot asking teh tech how she knew she was not missing spots and even poited out missed areas and she insisted that it was okay and the the hair would fall out. But I knew better becuse the area was not even soft adnd teh surface hair was still there.Basically, she used a cutrea yag laser with 10 mm spot sie and 40j on my bikini area and legs. She basiaclly sis these shots of laser, blip blip blip blip blip in lines on my legs. And is is clealy visaible that there are stripes on my legs. Areas that were targeted and those that were not. I just did it yesturday and my legs are sooooo prickly.

What should I do. I am going to go back and talk ro them. But I just feel that its not right that I have to tell her how to do her job. Im so ANGRY!! I am getting married in july and I wanted to get one session right before the wedding and be smooth for the wedding, but they way she is doing this I will be prickly and patchy for the wedding.

#20

Your not telling her how to do her job hun, your asking her to give you the result she promised. I’m guessing she advertised something along the lines of “laser for hair removal”. Hair removal means the whole area, whereas if she advertised “tiger stripes hair removal” then she would be fulfilling her end of the bargain.
Wait until the hairs longer so she can see it rather than turning a blind eye. If she tries to fob you off with the story of hairs under the skin coming through and the dormancy rubbish, simply turn around and say that the hair should be coming out sporadically, not in uniform lines if that was the case.

If you do have large missed pathces such as lines and so on and she still doesn’t accept responsibility - my advice would be to look else where, even if it does mean travelling further. The companies that can’t be bothered to give you customer satisfaction when they’ve made an error may have a tendancy in the future to turn around and bite you in the arse at every available opportunity.

Regards,
Benji