Facial hair removal (18 year old w/ pics)

Hair Removal Methods Laser hair removal
#61

I feel like I’m trying to give you unbiased advice, but that you already made up your mind and refuse to learn. So I’ll leave you with the following answers to your response and let you do whatever you feel is best.

One thing I ask is that you don’t come back to the forum with complaints on anything we’re warned you about. If you come back and experience what we discussed, promise to admit in your post that you were warned and chose to go another direction :slight_smile:

Now:

  • It’s not that hard to estimate. I’m sure you have thousands of hairs, not hundreds, on both the face and the stomach/chest area. You can take a small sample of a spot that’s 1 in x 1 in and count the number of hairs there. Then estimate how many of those spots you have filled with hair and multiply. It’s not that hard.

  • You don’t provide your location in your posts. It can be worth commuting for a good laser treatment since you only have to go once every 2 months.

  • Estimates over the phone are useless. They need to see you to see how much hair you have and how dense it is.

  • There is absolutely no more chance for burns on an area with acne compared to an area without. That statement is without merit. Burns, which are very rare, happen when settings used are too high, i.e. too much heat. Laser is attracted ONLY to dark pigment. The only dark pigment on your body is your hair. Laser can’t tell whether there is acne because it doesn’t have pigment and won’t touch it. It goes straight for the hair.

  • Electrolysis hasn’t been confirmed with any studies. It’s been grandfathered in since it’s been around for a while.

  • Both electrolysis and laser work in good hands. BOTH don’t work in bad hands. If you think you won’t get bad electrolysis treatments that won’t give you any results after spending hours and a year on treatments, you’re being naive. Finding a good electrologist involves just as much effort as finding a good laser tech. The benefit with laser is that you’ll know that you’re not getting results right after the first treatment. With electrolysis, you can be going for a year and only find out then.

  • Price has nothing to do with a clinic’s reputation or effectiveness. A clinic’s ads also have nothing to do with their actual experience and knowledge. Just because someone advertizes that they’re great and have lots of experience and best lasers, doesn’t mean that’s true. In your case, the settings used on your one treatment were not optimal. So I would have to doubt their experience and knowledge based on that alone.

  • Laser has been around for 12+ years now. There are published studies, but most don’t mean anything anyway since they’re sponsored by laser manufacturers in most cases and aren’t unbiased. Hair doesn’t just grow back if it was treated properly. And if it does and it wasn’t, you’ll be able to tell right away. If the hair is gone for 6+ months, it won’t be coming back. If there is any new growth after that, it’s NEW hair your body develops. In your case, you should really understand this since you’re only 18 and your body will be developing NEW hair into your late 20s. So you’ll likely need touchups.

  • There is no dispute that laser works permanently on dark coarse dense hair at the right settings. Any stories you hear of or read regarding results always have a reason for it, i.e. usually improper type of hair treated, not optimal machine an/or settings. The problem is that there are clinics out there who will tell you anything and treat any hair just to get your money. Those are the clinics you need to avoid.

#62

Hey I appreciate the unbiased advice, I am just being practical in my replies and telling you what I know and what I believe to be correct, though I do tend to write… too fucking much. Apologies for inconsistency.

One thing I ask is that you don’t come back to the forum with complaints on anything we’re warned you about. If you come back and experience what we discussed, promise to admit in your post that you were warned and chose to go another direction smile

Okay, agreed. But as I said, im not getting electrolysis done on my face, im getting it done on my chest because I have so little hair there (but enough to disgust me) and dont wanna pay for a full-price laser treatment. I said I would CONSIDER getting it done on my face if the electrologist can convince me that its more cost effective. If it takes 15-20 hours per treatment at $47/h then its not cost effective, if it takes only 5-6 then it is.

It’s not that hard to estimate. I’m sure you have thousands of hairs, not hundreds, on both the face and the stomach/chest area. You can take a small sample of a spot that’s 1 in x 1 in and count the number of hairs there. Then estimate how many of those spots you have filled with hair and multiply. It’s not that hard.

Okay, I looked at the close-up pic of me that I posted and estimate probably 80 per square cm , so… 10000 hairs? That cant be right, but wouldnt be surprised if its true. This might sound retarded but I actually cant count, if I try I fuck up really fast.

  • There is absolutely no more chance for burns on an area with acne compared to an area without. That statement is without merit. Burns, which are very rare, happen when settings used are too high, i.e. too much heat. Laser is attracted ONLY to dark pigment. The only dark pigment on your body is your hair. Laser can’t tell whether there is acne because it doesn’t have pigment and won’t touch it. It goes straight for the hair.

This is where Im skeptical of your advice. The swollen area around acne breakouts are DARK RED so it makes sense that the area would attract more heat from the laser unlike my light pale skin. Why would the nurse laser technician tell me the laser will burn my skin unless I come back zit-free?

And im not visiting this clinic because of the high price, im going because its the only one where its owned by a plastic surgeon, who are supposed to be the most ideal practitioners of LHR, all the other clinics are from $250-$280 so its not much difference.

#63

And thanks for the read edokid, but they use different wavelengths/settings for that. One designed to target and destroy dark pigment is not something I would invite to darker regions on my skin.

#64

Laser is not attracted to red. Pigment needs to be black or brown. Laser can’t see red at all. In fact, you can use a red marker to outline areas you want treated and laser won’t “see” this at all. You can use either red or white for this.

Many laser nurses and clinics in general don’t know what they’re doing. That’s why this forum is so popular now and why there are so many unfortunate stories about laser not producing results. It’s a quick money-making business, so many want to play, without knowing how difficult it actually is.

Whether a clinic is owned by a plastic surgeon is irrelevant. In fact, most MDs don’t know much about hair removal at all. They don’t teach it at med school, so there is no reason they would. The people who know most about it are those treating patients all day every day for years, and those who educate themselves by attending conferences and learning about the latest developments. MDs add laser to their business for pure profit. It’s a quick way to make a buck, especially since it’s not covered by insurance.

Any electrologist who will tell you they can clear your face in 5-6 hours will be lying to you.

You’re likely correct in your estimate. You’re talking thousands of hairs on your face.

I don’t know what “darker regions” of your skin you’re referring to, but I can assure you that if African Americans can get safe and effective laser treatments without any side effects, so can you. We’ve had several success stories posted here. Search for lalaka’s posts. It’s a matter of setting appropriate settings, i.e. the right combination of joules and pulse width.

#65

Im not sure if a healing zit is a true red hue, it is closer to reddish dark brown.

It could be possible that nurse is full of shit, but i’m better safe than sorry so i’ll go back when i’m looking hotter :slight_smile: I only have one face after all, and theres no fixing it if I get Luke Skywalkered.

#66

Hey Murach,

I didn’t mean that the same lasers used for hair removal are the ones that treat acne, I was just replying to where you said lasers don’t treat acne just scars. It’s probably IPL that does acne.

I agree with LAGirl about going in for consultations though. My clinic’s website said $130 for male face, and $220 for full front. I went in, it’s $75 for my full face and neck, and when I’ve done full front, it’s been $80.

#67

Laser doesn’t affect acne in any negative way. It can’t. There is absolutely no validity to what she told you. Only someone with zero understanding on how lasers and light works would say that.

#68

If you insist, i’ll go by next monday and book an appointment. Can you give me any irrefutable scientific facts that I can prove her wrong with if she says it again? Cuz I am really sick of delaying the treatment, I wanna get it OVER WITH so I can move on.

#69

This is like asking for scientific evidence that vaccuum cleaners don’t cause more hair growth. No one suspects that they do, so no one invested money into testing the theory.

I’m not insisting on anything. I’m just outlining reasoning here. You can make your own informed decision. We just make sure that you are properly informed. The rest is in your hands.

If you’re going to the same clinic who used the settings mentioned in your signature, I would advise you to ask them to use a larger spot size (if possible…I don’t know which Yag it is and whether it has an adjustable spot size since you don’t mention its name) because 5mm is pretty ineffective. Joules could be much lower once you increase the spot size.

#70

Well, if you proposed that vacuum cleaners could encourage hair growth, you would be required to back that up. I would tell you that external suction on top of the skin doesnt exactly produce hormones and all the chemical reactions necessary to build new follicles.

If a nurse, trained by a plastic surgeon with 6 years of experience tells me my face is likely to be burned if laser is used on acne regions, then I take that shit seriously, unless someone can academically explain why this would not happen.

And no I am not going to the same clinic, because the doc kicked me outta that one, remember? This new one uses 10mm spot size I think, but this really doesnt concern me, because the last tiny 5mm spot size worked fine. I still have the bald spots on my face from previous treatment.

#71

5 or 10 is so small you’re just asking for patches. You need to just go and do it instead of arguing on here with everyone. Everyone is just trying to help out. If a nurse told you it’s bad, and you want to believe that, then believe it! Why waste energy here arguing with LAGirl like as if she’s going to produce some magical document for you that makes everything better? So many people on here just rant and rave instead of actually doing anything about it.

#72

The appointment is not in weeks, you make it sound like LHR practitioners do room service because we have free health care in Canada, wake up. If I were to get on the phone and demand to resume treatment now, I would have to wait until next monday. So thats 6 days worth of ranting and raving at the least.

Keep your spam out of my thread.

#73

I have NO idea what your post there means, what does health care in Canada have anything to do with you ranting on here about treatment options? I call my clinic and get an appointment next day, but I don’t see what that has to do with anything. You’re just sitting here arguing with LAgirl because she says laser won’t hurt your acne and your nurse says it will. My point is what do you want from this thread? You clearly trust the nurse and are going by them so what’s with the swearing and constant ranting??

#74

Not arguing, just exchanging experiences, information and educating each other. Now kindly chill the fuck out, Im here for the exact same reason you and everybody else here is. Ill trust the nurse when she elaborately explains with scientific facts why the laser would torch red-tinted regions on my face and i’ll trust LAGirl when she explains in a similar manner. In the meantime, i’ll assume worst case scenario, because this is my fucking face were talking about, I got 40 more years to show it off before I’ll willfully experiment on it for the benefit of the community like this one.

This answer your question?

#75

No not really, it just shows that you’re an immature teenager that thinks they look cool by writing on a forum swearing every other sentence, when the reality is it just makes them look completely unprofessional.

#76

Edokid is correct that using a small spot size puts you at much higher risk of patchy results. Take a look at some results photos online to see what I mean.

10mm is still relatively small, but it’s much better than 5mm. You still need to make sure that they overlap well to avoid patchiness which is very difficult to fix.

P.S. You need to keep your language and tone professional here. This forum is paid for by someone (Andrea) and there are rules involved in using it (for free). Banning is not out of question.

#77

No not really, it just shows that you’re an immature teenager that thinks they look cool by writing on a forum swearing every other sentence, when the reality is it just makes them look completely unprofessional.


Do me a favor and quit posting in here, you are cluttering up my thread with your content-lacking sentences.

LAGirl, I tried google searching with several variations to find photos of patchy results, but i couldnt find any.

I also cant seem to find any paper online that elaborately explains the role of the spot size. I know its the width of the laser beam, but what exactly does this have to do with patchiness? If my previous technician used a larger spot size and lower amount of joules, how do you think my results would differ? Would I get more uniform hair removal or something?

P.S. You need to keep your language and tone professional here. This forum is paid for by someone (Andrea) and there are rules involved in using it (for free). Banning is not out of question.

Umm, excuse me, I am not being paid for sharing my unbiased, confidential and clinical information, as well as photos which is getting this site traffic and possibly aiding in useful research. You are getting this shit for free, and so is whoever runs this site. I think I will be the one who will set the god damn rules when it comes to my thread.

Keep this friendly reality check in mind before you lecture me again. I can simply leave if it suits you, and you will never find out how my treatment turned out. For the record, I havent gained anything useful from this site so far and it had no affect or turning points on my treatments (I got the first treatment BEFORE I came on the site. I joined to report and participate like everyone else.)

All I keep getting is conflicting information from the technicians/nurses in this city and you/couple others, and there is no real discussion, just “he said she said” bullshit.

Example, a couple months ago you said:

They’re using a very tiny spot size. Someone there doesn’t know how to operate this machine for hair removal. It can also be used for other skin treatments and that spot size would probably be appropriate for that. But for hair removal, that spot size is useless (and on all lasers, as spot size is decreased, the joules are automatically adjusted up).

What the doctor is saying is not true. ALL treated hair should shed. That explanation makes no sense.

Useless, yet it worked, massive shedding hadnt occured, yet permanent reduction had occured. Your credibility in at least two clinical facts is now questionable. But note, i am not ATTACKING you. Ive thanked you for your advice when it was useful and ill do so again. I am just giving you the facts.

#78

Those are pretty ridiculous and offensive statements (I could only imagine those coming from a privileged only child). You don’t really understand how the world works yet. I guess I’ll have to help you with your first lesson.

Let’s start with: You haven’t done anything for me or anyone here. No one owes you anything.

Now, your one story is not going to change anything on the forum. You’re just one of the thousands. Me (and edokid and others here) answering questions for free at the expense of my time does, on the other hand. We get nothing out of this. YOU do. For free.

You will now be able to learn this from personal experience. I am done contributing to your thread. I would much rather spend my time on more appreciative people.

#79

You’re completely ignorant and undeserving of anyone’s help, and the constant swearing makes yourself look incredibly foolish. I’ve seen you’re “before” pictures in your thread here; put it this way you have a lot more work to do on yourself than just hair removal.

I’m also done replying on your pointless thread. However I’ll answer one last thing to anyone else that does read this forum. How does a smaller 5 or 10mm spot size result in more patchiness you ask? It’s like trying to completely cover a piece of paper using a stamp that’s the size of an eraser on a pencil versus a stamp that’s the size of a bingo dabber. It doesn’t matter how close you go or how hard you try, you won’t get 100% coverage with the eraser head, where as the bingo dabber is much larger and easier to ensure full coverage. This is even more of a to the point example because using a stamp you’d be able to see your results, unlike with a laser where you can’t go back and see if you missed anywhere.

Furthermore, a larger spot size penetrates deeper, and hair on the face (especially chin) is VERY deep. Too deep in fact for 5 or 10mm to even hit the root.

#80

Let’s start with: You haven’t done anything for me or anyone here. No one owes you anything.

Sure I have, I have provided clinical proof that a ND YAG 1064 Sciton at 85J and 5mm provides permanent hair reduction on a type 3 skin male beard, so now you know not to keep giving misleading and bullshit advice in the future such as “5mm wont work, your technician is being retarded”.

Do you realize: if I was offered a job to be a human test subject for something like this, I would charge $1000 at the least per session. You would only get $30 per “consultation” which is what you generally do on this site when you give advice, but seeing as how you just echo hear-says and memorized facts based on your experience as a customer and not someone with any certification or experience in the LHR field. And hey, I can do that too now. I know what worked on me so I can give viable advice to someone of the same skin type that wants to remove his beard.

We are equal, deal with it.

Now, your one story is not going to change anything on the forum. You’re just one of the thousands. Me (and edokid and others here) answering questions for free at the expense of my time does, on the other hand. We get nothing out of this. YOU do. For free.

Show me one instance where ANY “advice” in this thread has positively influenced any decision ive made? I got nothing out of you or this site, but I never really expected to, that is why I signed up and posted photos 3 days after the first appointment, in pure generosity.

Your typical idiotic American “your one of thousands, so the fact that youre a productive worker keeping my ass alive and rich is worthless because i can replace you tomorrow” attitude wont get you anywhere in reality in the long run, but whatever, you’re older and so im not qualified to keep giving you reality checks I guess.

I’ll think about keeping my thread updated on my progress in the future, but nobody is getting any more clinical information or photos. This isnt the first time my voluntary participation in an internet-based project has been full of condescending dicks.

Furthermore, a larger spot size penetrates deeper, and hair on the face (especially chin) is VERY deep. Too deep in fact for 5 or 10mm to even hit the root.

Yet I have experienced removal ESPECIALLY on the chin. Whats funny is that the doc who kicked me outta his clinic told me that people on the internet talk outta their ass so its very likely what i’m hearing is bullshit, and I guess he was right.