Hi All
Test: I’d be interested in your many professional opinions for work on the toes of the feet. Laser? Electrolysis? Time required? Clearances? Efficacy? Permanancy? Skin changes?
Please find attached the link below:
https://postimg.cc/gallery/gzzo1u88/
History of hair removal in these areas: Trimming only.
Easy treated with electrolysis.
Required 3 clearances spread apart in 2-3 months to catch all hair growth cycles.Outcome-permanent.Skin change-none, only temporary side effects.
Laser outcome- unknown.Posible laser induced hair growth.
With electrolysis:
I’d say roughly 3 - 5 clearances with a TTT of 6 - 10 hours (est. on the high side). Furthermore, with 99% certainty, you will have PIH, post inflammatory hyperpigmentation (little post-treatment dark spots) that will last up to a year; and go away totally. For a while, the spots will look like you still have hair.
Well-performed electrolysis will render your feet permanently hair-free for the rest of your life … guaranteed.
I second those facts! You can bet on electrolysis, in any form, to give you permanent hair removal.
I personally like high intensity thermolysis with quick timing for this area because this area can sensitive. For sensation issues, it’s like pulling the band-aid off quickly and most clients like that approach, by zapping the area “quick like a bunny!”.
YES, expect some temporary skin side effects, especially, post inflammatory hyperpigmentation (brown dots). Depending on your immune system and the amount of energy needed to make the hair slide, these brown dots may take several weeks? months? or even a year to fade away. THEY WILL FADE AWAY, so don’t flip out if this is how your skin reacts. It will be all worth it and you will have clear, hairless skin for the rest of your life.
Great feedback. Keep it coming…
Yeah! Nicely, we have identified the most likely “side effect.” When patients are told … they are less likely to panic. Eyes wide open! Please, fellow zappers, full disclosure will make everybody’s life so much easier!
My UCLA eye surgeon was not so forth coming. I wanted the pre- and post-op instructions (in writing) but his staff would not send them to me (never responded to calls or three letters over a 4-week period).
So, I drove to UCLA (100 miles in the L.A. freeway nightmare) and got the documents (post-op only). It comprised 3-pages (single spaced) of post-op instructions and side-effects. A monumental list, including laying on my face for three days (day and night), no driving in a car for three weeks, no swimming for a month (the worst one for me), pain and bleeding from the eye … etc.
Q. How was I supposed to drive back to Santa Barbara (100 miles) “on my face?” Maybe strapped to the hood like the old Pontiac Indian hood ornament?
I quit! (I also quit, because they had me scheduled for a heart valve replacement). Great surgeon. The staff was very nice but ridiculous (not one was a native English speaker, and I could hardly understand them). Lucky I quit, because the UCLA nursing staff (most of them) went out on STRIKE! UCLA is a medical factory.
(So, I’m back to surgeon “Steve Couvillion.” Fun, I suppose, because I taught him how to sail when he was 12-years-old and I was 24.) Hope he remembers it’s my “Starboard” (not “Port”) eye!
Michael are you suggesting to share the work out over the 3-5 clearances?
Is someone able to give me an estimation on what percentage of hairs are present at the time of the photo?
I think I know what you’re asking!
By clearances, they mean get rid of all the hairs in the area 3-5 times, not one pass that will take 3-5 appointments. Depending on the electrologist, not every hair will be killed after a zap (it will regrow), that’s why you’re gonna have to come back a few times.
And like you said, there are also several hidden hairs at any time. I tried to find the percentage (on my face) and I’m pretty sure there were at least 40% hidden, but the body is probably different. I don’t think there’s a way to know for sure, plus I can’t seem to find too much info on this…
Interesting, I don’t believe Michael’s reply to be deliberately vague just my flawed understanding. From my understanding one clearance is removal of all hair present. Second clearance is all hair present after first clearance etc. If electrolysis can destroy the hair first time around why 3-5 clearances? Assuming you have a good electrologist. Unless it’s due to reaction etc which is what I’m trying to ascertain.
You make a good point with regards hair in different areas on body (hormones/genetics)
Whilst we have fun conversations, “Zapmyface” your post illustrates this electrologists eternal frustration with Hairtell: patients offering suggestions/data/definitive answers to other patient’s questions; that are inherently incorrect/misleading or even dangerous.
Except for Dee (decades of experience) and Seana (new to the trade), here are virtually no electrologists on this forum because of this one salient reality.
It’s like this, after explaining something 350,000 times (to newbies) you can’t “freakin” do it anymore. Sure, it sounds new to “y’all” … it’s ancient history to me (us). I know the answer, but won’t “go there” for the one-thousandth time. One answer creates five more questions, and on-and-on.
For example somebody, again, is going to post about the horrors of those “permanent” dark dots. Every electrologist will read it and think, “Oh, not this shit again!”
What about a forum that has, for example, a REAL dermatologist that can answer “skin questions” once-and-for-all … instead of the “pissing in the wind” that is the foundation of most on-line forums? It’s something that MIGHT happen in the getting-more-distant future.
Here’s the deal: TALK TO YOUR ELECTROLOGIST! Go there first and ask your questions. Maybe read something or watch some videos. If it doesn’t make sense, then go to the internet and “ask the world!” That’s what I do! (Yeah, I know, people don’t read and they want quick answers … won’t watch entire 10-minute videos either.)
Is this what they call a “Mic drop?”
Answer: go on-line and look-up “hair shedding cycle.” Therein lies your answer.
Thank you Michael we got there in the end. Are you able to give an estimation of the hair present in the photo?
What was incorrect in what I said? You don’t necessarily have to explain but you could simply tell me what part.
If it’s about that ‘‘100% kill rate’’ nonsense again I’m gonna have to argue about it… Not because I think that you’re wrong, but because of the reality that not every electrologist is as good or experienced as you. You might do that 3 clearance method, but wouldn’t you say that what (most?) people experience with other electrologists is much different?
Actually when I answer those types of question, I exactly think about how tiring it must be to explain the same thing over and over, which is why I’m trying to lift some work off the pro’s shoulders sort of speak. Granted it’s my understanding of it so it could be inherently flawed, however I’m always here to learn.
If you were talking about the % of hidden hairs, I’ve honestly never seen any numbers about it anywhere (or if I did it was pretty vague). Is this in your book?
Yep, in the book(s) … mine and all the others: front and center.
I think it’s about who/what y’all want to be: informed patients (getting good work), becoming an electrologist, the love/fun of “advice giving” (?).
I don’t want to quell anybody’s enthusiasm, but the answers are there if a person takes the time to read. Imagine going on an automotive blog and asking, “Why do I have to change the oil?” Then followed by, “What is a piston ring?” Followed by, “How does and IC engine work?”
Still, the best option is to ask your electrologist first. Sure many ARE dolts and have read little-to-nothing themselves, (God bless the unlicensed States!). Maybe asking them pointed questions MIGHT encourage them to do a little reading/studying too? I’m doubtful though … “don’t confuse me with the facts!”
Well my enthusiasm comes from conflicting or vague answers from different electrologists or sources, I’d love to know the truth, that’s it. Coincidentally I got conflicting answers with dermatologists too. Which is why I’ve learned to have extreme skepticism over beauty-related subjects (and why I’m doing my own tests for the most important questions I’ve got).
You’d be surprised to know that I’ve read quite a bit of free sources already (and watched all your videos as far as I remember), but I agree that I should probably get on with those more in depth books like yours or Hinkel’s (edit: actually I’ve been reading it for an hour now, I WILL FINISH IT AS SOON AS I CAN!)
I guess Seana was right all along in saying what everyone else was thinking. I’ll stop giving my very ‘‘adapted for the client from a client’’ simple advice (that I still think I’m right about, at least in my own personal reality of electro).
Actually I’m still unsure as to what I’ve said was incorrect, anybody else that’s not tired of answering those questions can explain? (no rude intent here, I completely understand why some won’t)
Now, that’s a reasonable question: “How many hairs in the photo?”
Simple: if you have not shaved (or plucked) the area you are looking at (plus/minus)40% -to- (maximum)50% of the follicles in the area.
Thank you Michael
Answer: Opinions are subjective the “Proof is in the pudding”. Please see photo below taken in May 2018.
Long answer: Toes treated using Electrolysis (flash thermolysis) in July 2012. One clearance only. Time taken to treat both feet approximately 60 minutes. As you can see considering the time elapsed (6 Years) all hairs treated have not returned, skin condition has actually improved. No other method of hair removal used in the period.
Point of this thread: Thermolysis can be as effective as galvanic or blend. Sessions need not to be planned, you can get it right first time independent of the phase with a competent electrologist, in this case Josefa M Reina.
Forgive me for initially feigning ignorance, it was necessary for me to achieve my goal and showcase the results. Looking forward to your responses. At least we can be united on applauding the results right? 
WE’VE ALL BEEN FOOLED LOL I’M SCREAMING AT MY SCREEN!!!