darkish skin / thick beard questions

Hair Removal Methods Laser hair removal
#1

Hi, I’ve got a few questions about laser hair removal. I’ve attached a couple of pictures for reference [South-Asian male].

My initial goal was simply to get rid of the hideous neck beard, I’ve since then decided I probably want to eliminate all my facial hair.

Towards that end, I went down to a local place that has a Candela GentleLASE Plus. The operator said it should be fine for my skin type and the test patch she did on my neck seems to be alright as well. However, she also said that some of the darker areas on my chin could be tricky.

First question I suppose would be: could a GentleLASE Plus work for me or should I find a place that has a YAG? Also, as per the skin type definitions, do I fall under IV or V?

Secondly, while I’ve always had issues with ingrown hairs, in the past 6 months I’ve had rampant infections on my chin, as should be evident from the second picture [scabs are because I have the terrible habit of picking at them]. Are these going to be an issue when it comes to using a laser in the area? Any way I can prep them to make this process easier?

Any other tips or pointers would be most appreciated as well. I’m due to head back in a week to see what they think of the test patch. If they’re satisfied it’s going to work, I was planning on going ahead with it.

#2

I think you should go for nd:yag! For south-Asian skin, yag works better. You probably are skin type 5.

#3

  • There is absolutely no way you should be using an alex laser like GentleLASE. They need to be put out of business for suggesting that. The only way they could treat you is by using such low settings, that you won’t see any results at all. It frustrates me that clinics do this.

  • You can ONLY use a Yag laser. You’re around a type V.

  • The hair on your neck is best treated with electrolysis, not laser. It’s really not coarse or dense enough for laser. On your skin type, that means that it can actually make the situation worse by inducing more hair. If it was me, I’d go straight for electrolysis on this particular area. If you want to try laser first, you can, but be aware of the risks. I personally don’t think it will be very effective there.

  • Male beards are hard to treat. I would only trust it to a very experienced provider with a good Yag laser with a large spot size who knows how to overlap well and use good settings. Otherwise, you’ll end up with patchy results.

  • You can’t achieve 100% removal with laser. Laser can only kill coarse hair. When finer sparse hair remains, you’ll need electrolysis.

  • Laser will make the ingrowns and shadow disappear. It’s actually good for that.

  • Please read our FAQs if you haven’t already. Link below.

#4

Thanks for the info folks.

I did do a cursory level of research [evidently, not quite thorough enough] before heading down there, but I didn’t find these forums until later. The Laser FAQ is very useful.

I’ve found a few places that have YAG lasers nearby, I’ll now be getting in touch with a few of them to schedule consultations. Armed with far more knowledge than before, I should hopefully be able to get better information and advice with some targeted questions.

YAG on the beard and electrolysis on the neck seems to be the way to go. I think I’d just assumed that lasers [pew pew] would work for everything since it’s newer technology.

I’ll head over to the electrolysis forums as well to see if I can find out more about it. Thanks again!

#5

I went down to another place that, aside from looking a lot more professional, has an nd:YAG laser.

The consultant was very helpful and the advice I got from there was a lot more in line with what I’ve read on these forums and in the FAQ [i.e. recommending the correct type of laser to start with].

One thing I wanted to check up on was the settings they want to use. They said they would use an 18 mm spot size, start with a low energy setting [12 joules] and work up to a higher setting later [20 joules]. This seems less than what I’ve seen recommended for Type V skin, i.e. I’m sure I read somewhere that Type V can handle 30-35 joules easily.

So, what are the likely outcomes of starting with 12 joules, given my current state of skin/hair? I get the feeling I won’t be seeing dramatic results at this low setting, but perhaps they know something I don’t? Should I ask them to raise this, maybe start at 15-20 and work up to 30? I don’t want to push for a higher setting, get burned [literally and figuratively] and then have them say “Well, we wanted to go 12-20, you pushed us for higher settings.”

Would appreciate some feedback on this.

#6

If you’re using a Candela GentleYag Type V definitely can’t handle 30J at 18mm - you’d end up with some pretty bad burns! 30J is the maximum setting on the 18mm spot size and recommended for skin types III and under. I’m sure LAGirl will have better advice regarding the appropriate settings, but I’m a skin type 4 or 4.5 and they haven’t gone higher than 18mm/18J on me and I’ve still had great results.

#7

I’m assuming they’re using the Candela Yag, GentleYag, as I’m not aware of other Yags with an 18mm spot size. If that’s the case, the highest joules setting on that machine is 30J on 18mm.

Also, pulse width is adjustable on this machine, so you need to inquire what they would use. On GentleLASE alex it’s fixed at 3ms. On GentleYAG, this is the lowest it can go, but most techs would use something higher on your skin type.

I would ask them to do spot tests. 12J seems pretty low to me since 30J is max, even on your skin type, but it’s really impossible to tell over the internet. They need to test. But if she thinks that 20J won’t burn (not sure what pulse width she’s using with that once again…3ms would be very strong, but 40ms wouldn’t be), then there is no reason not to start with 20J.

#8

Sorry, I should have specified that it’s a Candela YAG laser. I didn’t ask about pulse width but I think I can get this from them by telephone.

Once again, thanks for the input.

#9

Can’t edit the first post, could I please get a mod to change the title to “[Journal] Type V Male Beard/Neck”? Thanks.

Well, I decided to go ahead with one of the places I checked out on my second recon. Had my first session last Friday and it went alright.
Session 1 - 16 April 2010
Laser: Candela GentleYAG
Joules: 12
Pulse Width: 30, 30 [not sure of the notation for this]
Spot Size: 18 mm

I stuck with 12 joules instead of pushing for higher. Err on the side of caution and so forth. Also, I had no reference point for pain levels etc, so I figured that starting with slightly restrained settings would let me ease into the process. They plan on increasing by 2 joules each session.

Some areas went by relatively smoothly, these were the areas where hair was less thick. Some areas were quite sensitive and I felt a lot more [still tolerable] pain, the jawline for example. Upper lip wasn’t as painful as I had built it up to be [I read that it has a higher concentration of nerve endings].

Afterwards, I was quite hot and they had me blow cold air into my face [from a distance], which was quite soothing. Applied some cream as well. On the drive home, I had the aircon on and pointing at my face, which helped quite a lot. Put on more aloe vera cream when I got home, the warmness faded within a few hours.

I was sensitive all weekend, but no real swelling. I also didn’t get red. I’m guessing 12 joules is too weak. I’m now debating asking them to go 12-16-20 instead of 12-14-16-18-20 as they’re planning.

I’ve had a huge amount of ingrown hairs appear on my chin [where they usually do] and a few in new areas as well, e.g. under chin, jawline and cheek. I understand this is normal, correct?

I also understand that the shedding process can take up to 3 weeks. During this time, is it safe for me to shave my face? I work as a software developer, so I can get away with a certain level of unkempt-ness [hurrah!]. However, if possible, I’d like to be able to shave.

I hope to maintain this journal with some degree of discipline.

#10

Glad things went well! Not sure about ingrown hairs I’ve never hard that usually laser gets rid of them. Everything else sounds normal though. Usually on the face right after treatment it’s super red for 30-40 minutes or so then it goes down. Unlike other areas on the body, I always find it feels tender for a good day or two afterwards and I can’t even touch shaving it. After 3 days though you can shave it’s okay. The thing though is now shaving helps a bit since the hair falls out much easier.

Shedding takes awhile, I always start seeing hairs fall out on schedule right at day 7 then at day 10 really falling out. I find what really helps is getting a salt or sugar scrub from body shop or anywhere. That makes the hair fall out so fast for me.

#11

Yea I was told that gentle exfoliating after 7 days is helpful with the shedding process, so I was planning on doing that. Monday morning will have been nearly 3 days and so I may try shaving if you reckon it’ll be ok.

#12

Yeah it will be fine. For me for 1-2 days my face is a bit tender and sore, doesn’t look it just feels it. I also find my skin feels a bit off so I wouldn’t even want to go near it with a razor, but after a couple days it’s fine and you can shave. It can be weird shaving though since the hair is pretty much dead and killed, I find it’s really hard to get a close shave so looks bad. I’d just exfoliate, gentle or not haha. I actually just make a home made salt scrub or sugar scrub which works amazing, but again not until day 7 or so since before that your face is a bit sore, so do it when you feel good. The first one I made I put literally half a cup of coarse salt (just used kosher salt since its coarse), then a bit of brown sugar, few tbsp of sesame oil and mixed it up. I had purchased an actual scrub before so I just keep the one I made in the same jar but it lasts just as long. When that one ran out I made my most recent with literally brown sugar and olive oil and it works really well also.

#13

An olive oil/salt scrub similar to the one edokid mentioned is like the most amazing leg treatment, too. Makes your legs shiny and smooth like the airbrushed supermodels. :smiley:

I can’t speak about a male beard, but shaving legs after a laser treatment is haaaard. The hair is crispy and charred (even if it seems normal at first), so when you shave it, you look like you got into a fight with a weed-wacker, and you’re so stubbly. I bet a beard is even worse.

#14

You MAY be okay with the Yag. When I’d shave after an alex treatment, it was like Kitty said, rough and looked bad. It didn’t look bad in the sense that the hair was messed up, I just found it looked almost like I hadn’t shaved at all. Like you’d see all the stubble, it looked like the last time you shaved was the previous day. When I had my Yag treatment last time, the hair looked completely normal and shaving was no problem.

I agree about the scrub too! I’ve never used it on legs but I first used it on my forearms after a session and it makes them feel amazing. You can buy one, but they’re literally just oil with salt and so on so easy to just make it yourself.

#15

  • Yes, give it 3 weeks for shedding to complete. For this area, it’s very important that the majority sheds and whatever doesn’t gets touched up at 3 weeks to avoid future patchiness.

  • Yes, those settings are pretty low. On 18mm on GentleYAG, 30J is max, and 3ms is the lowest pulse. So those are pretty low in comparison.

  • If they think you can handle 20J without burning, there is no advantage to treating you at anything lower than that at all. You should always be treated at the highes tyour skin can handle safely.

  • This area has very coarse and dense growth. No swelling and redness is a huge indicator that the settings were way too low.

#16

Well, I chickened out this morning. My stubble felt a lot more “rough” than it normally does after 2-3 days of growth. Gently running my fingers across it, I can feel that the hair is crispy/charred, feels very different. Also, if I couldn’t get as close a shave as normal, it seemed kind of pointless. I got the feeling I would have the razor catch on hair instead of having it glide across the skin. As well, ingrown hairs persisted overnight and I didn’t want to slice off all the bumps.

I’m eager for shedding to begin, but will just have to be patient for now I suppose. Thanks for posting about your experiences, helps to get some perspective.

Edit: Just saw this post.

That’s fair enough, I think I’ll ask them to jump to 16J or straight to 20J next time.

Given that I’ve already had a session at 12J [i.e. with weak settings] what do you expect my shedding to look like? Patchy? Consistent but not as thorough?

#17

I was treated at really low settings my first time I think it was 18mm/10J or 15mm/10J, but I had no shedding at all. The hair just grew in slower for 2 or 3 weeks. When I had my first effective treatment hair started shedding within 3-5 days and I had large patches where the skin was completely clear and within 2 weeks it was pretty much all clear.

#18

I just did full face and neck yesterday with Yag again man that hurt for some reason. My huge tip, make sure they put something to cool it after either ice or blowing cold air on it. They usually do for awhile with me but this time I went in for a touch up and they did the whole face so they didn’t blow the air on it for as long after.

Usually when I get home I wash my face with cold water to wash off any creams they put on or ultrasound gel then I ice it. This time I washed it but didn’t get to ice it. Before bed my face was super red bumpy all over the place like an allergic reaction. I iced it a bit then and went to bed. It’s much better today but definitely the worst reaction I’ve had. I had a similar one after my first treatment where I didn’t ice after either. So I strongly suggest everyone ices when they get home after to prevent any adverse reactions!

#19

My face a few hours after LHR on face and neck, this is with the Yag and usually only lasts like this for 30 minutes but didn’t do as much cooling this time so took a few hours to go away. Thought I’d post for anyone wondering how much fun LHR is for a guy on the face! (Or maybe to see how crazy I am just so I don’t have to shave anymore!?)

Explore Liam Smith

Don’t worry it’s completely gone now and is normal for me! I think I must be a bit crazy though, unlike some people that do it on their face because they have out of control hair or constantly have a 5 o’clock shadow, I’m strictly doing it for fun so I don’t have to shave as much and to get rid of lots of hair lol.

#20

Haha, no shedding at all will be so anticlimactic >.<

I wonder if I can call them up and ask for a touch up, show them I haven’t shed at all and get the whole shebang done again as the “touch up”. Having said that, it’s only been ~5 days for me so I’ll wait until this next weekend and call them up on Monday just to make sure I’m not a late shedder or anything. Judging by edokid’s picture though, I don’t think I’ll be shedding anything, as my reaction was very mild.

Given that I had such a weak treatment [with potentially no shedding], how quickly can I reschedule the next session? My next one is scheduled for June 5, but if I don’t shed at all, I don’t want to have to wait all that time. Would it be safe to go down for the second session, for example, within 2-3 weeks of the first ineffective session?

Thanks for the picture edokid, will give me some perspective when I get to that stage. I don’t think my growth has even slowed down a bit like KLT55’s. I will take a picture later of my hippy bearded look.