What's a good flash/blend unit for under $2K?

Hair Removal Methods Do-It-Yourself Electrolysis
#1

Hello all,

I’m looking to buy a decent flash/blend unit (preferably new) … And I’m noticing there’s like the “$2K” tier, and then the “$3.5K” tier of prices. I’m not exactly able to afford the best models, but I’m interested in getting something that’s going to work well and make me happy.

For under $2K, is there a good unit that does blend without needing a footpedal?

And another question, is it even possible for a unit to do true auto-timed flash or thermolysis without needing a footpedal? Or to accomplish this, would it have to be like a 1-second electrolysis + 1/100th flash still needing me to hold onto the electrode?

Right now, I’m kind of looking @ the Cleo Blend 256 or the Junior Plus … But anything that’s comparable to them in features and performance would suffice.

Thanks for your help.
~laz

#2

In order to do thermolysis without the footpedal, one must be in contact with the inactive pole/ground wire in order to give the machine feedback on when you have inserted the probe/needle into the skin. This does not cause the treatment to become a blend treatment.

there are many fine models that will allow you to accomplish this, the question is how many are available at this moment, and how can you arrange to buy them.

Keep a good watch on the “Legitimate Electrolysis Machines Available on Ebay” thread and many people post there used machines here as well.

#3

There is an Apilus Jr. Plus on eBay right now for $1995 but you can get a much better price if you wait and watch eBay closely.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Apilus-Junior-Plus-electrolysis-machine_W0QQitemZ290283968328. I think they go for about $2700 new (James might know exactly.) I landed an Apilus SM-500 for 1/4 that, but it took six months of looking and some serious haggling on my part (and needed a new black cord and needleholder and roller.) If you are buying for personal use, I’d wait and keep an eye open, you never know what kind of deal you can get.

The Instantron Elite Spectrum is $2300 new, if you are willing to pay $2300, and it can do all three modalities, with or without a footswitch. It is similar in features to the older Apilus Senior or SM-500.

#4

I just bought (based on recommendations in the thread that James mentions) a Senior II on Ebay for $1000. A great deal, IMHO, it sells new for about $3500. It is capable of doing times insertions. To be more specific to your question, there is a setting whereby you can set the time delay; when the needle completes the circuit, until the current is sent, is a time delay set by the user, either manually or by using the foot pedal. This allows for individual insertion speeds to be set. For example, a pro can insert, zap, and be going into the next follicle in .5-1 secs, whereas a new user will need considerably more time delay.

Keep checking Ebay, you’ll find a good one. But FWIW, I would make sure it makes the list in the thread above, or at the very least, post about it here to get feedback.

Good luck!

#5

OIC … So, in regards to thermolysis (flash or other) without the footpedal, I’m assuming that once the moisture in the follicle is obliterated with the AC current, it is unable to complete the “test” circuit to send another flash and that is when you’d remove the probe and go on to the next?

Since I’m far from professional and experienced (I do have about 150 hours or so with a galvanic unit) with quick-style insertion, I’d probably have to find something that could offer me an easy track of progression as I gained experience. But about operation without footpedal, would there be two different types … auto-timed and circuit-completed? Or just auto-timed? By circuit-completed, I mean like something that $30 galvanic unit does …

Also, is it worth it to have insulated probe settings (such as on the CLEO vs. the Junior Plus) … Or is that just more for marketing than it is for true value? And even then, when doing flash, is it actually an advantage to use insulated probes? Or does the hassle and high-maintenance kind of cancel out the potential benefits when compared to a straight probe?

About eBay, that sounds like a great idea. It’s a buyer’s economy right now, for the most part, so I’ll definitely keep my eyes open. I checked out that Apilus Jr. – not a bad deal … I’m keeping watch =].

To you both who have purchased used – How was the quality of your product? Totally pleased with its condition and performance?

So it seems, Apilus (or Dectro, I guess now?) is the only manufacturer who publishes decent specification sheets for their products. So it’s really hard to compare models. Aside from message boards and word of mouth, how’s one supposed to find out more about any of these manufacturers’ products? All of their websites just list the very basic features … Don’t go in depth into things that you wouldn’t want to “find out” later after purchasing.

Well, thanks for all your replies. I got a surprise bonus this year, and so I’m definitely considering this purchase for private use. Maybe not immediately, but for sure some time in the next few months.

Thanks again.
~laz

#6

The insulated probes are only good for thermolysis, with galvanic or blend the insulation disintegrates.

With my SM-500, first you set the treatment program (HF and/or DC and the time each follicle treatment lasts, it is not related to the insertion delay.)

Then, you set the insertion delay (0.1 to 10 seconds) and enable “auto” mode, and make sure the person being treated (yourself or someone else) is grounded to the machine. Insert the needle, and the moment the skin comes in contact with the skin (and remains in contact) the timing circuit is completed and the countdown begins. Once the time set passes, the treatment program begins and the energy is delivered down the needle into the follicle. Once the program is completed, the energy stops and the machine beeps (or stops beeping if using multiple pulses) and you know it is done and you can take the needle out and insert into another follicle.

#7

The Instantron machines that do have auto-sensor mode have one second as the lowest insertion delay possible. Too slow for me, but it would take you a while to get that fast.

On another topic, insulatd can be used for blend, but one must keep a keen eye on the probe, as the action of the treatment WILL dissolve the insulationg material as you work, eventually baring the probe, and exposing the skin to full treatment as if you had a regular probe to begin with.

#8

A one second insertion delay? That’s much too slow for me for most areas, though I have gone to 1.2 at most for very challenging areas. Not sure why they would only give that choice for the lowest delay, but okay!

#9

So does the insulation disintegration really matter, if one is not doing thermolysis? I mean, if one is doing blend with an insulated needle, and the insulation breaks down, the needle becomes a “regular” needle, right? You mention “exposing the skin to full treament…” like that is a bad thing, is why I ask.

Thanks,
Dave

#10

The point of an insulated probe is to limit the amount of the probe/needle that can deliver current. Without the insulation, you just have a regular probe. At that point the process is less forgiving of your short-comings.

#11

Good morning!

I totally have short-comings at this point =]. They’re maybe not as blatantly obvious when I’m using galvanic, but we’ll see how things go with flash …

Since I already have a set of insulated probes, I might as well use 'em when I finally get a unit. At least, with flash only, it would help me climb the experience ladder without falling off too many times.

So, for you all who do blend – do insulated probes then become more of a hassle? I had read in one of my books that insulated probes do break down, but they didn’t specify whether or not it happens when using any particular modality. I just figured it as all of 'em. Doesn’t happen (or happens far less frequently) when using just flash?

I’m definitely understanding the auto mode better. I was thinking it was the delay between pulling the needle out and getting the needle properly inserted into the next follicle. Glad to see it’s timed from initial needle insertion contact to full insertion. I can totally see how some of you more experienced electrologists would get fed up with 1-second delay.

When you’re treating funky hairs, do you adjust the delay? Or for that matter, do you prefer to go blend? (considering it’s a fairly decent-sized patch of 'em and not just one random straggler)

About that Apilus Junior Plus on eBay, what would ya’ll say is a fair market price for that pre-owned unit? I checked out a few of the links on the “Legitimate … eBay” thread, and I may have just been hallucinating, but I recollect seeing that same Jr. Plus machine for sale in a previous listing for the same price; or could it have possibly been a different unit just being sold by the same seller?

I find it odd that someone would fail to sell their item at a given price and then choose to re-list it at the same price wink. Maybe I should start haggling … As far as the things I’m looking for, that unit does seem relatively complete. And I hope none of ya’ll are contemplating the purchase too … I wouldn’t want to be steppin’ on anyone’s toes who’s a professional electrologist tryin’ to make a living.

Anyhow, I hope you are all set to enjoy the holidays … Thanks again!
~laz

#12

Gold ballet probes are great for doing blend. That’s what I use, but if I’m only doing a few hairs with blend, I don’t hesitate to do this with an insulated probe. I don’t use stainless steel probes at all.

Sometimes I adjust the insertion delay above one second in the beginning until I can figure some charactaristics of hair in a certain area or in an area where insertions are difficult, like under the chin or the neck of an obese client. Once I get the feel of things and the client is positioned correctly, I will lower the insertion to delay to between .5 - .9 seconds and get into a rythmn of work.

I would think that a used epilator should be priced 40%-60% of it’s new value if it is in good condition. For the more in demand epilators, probably less percentage off. Older epilators with knobs, I’m guessing 70%-80% off the original price would be a deal. James is the guy that knows this stuff, so correct me if I’m wrong here.

I have come to realized that I underpriced a digital Gentronics that I still own because the company owner thought I had an analog Gentronics and priced it for resale as an analog. When he listened closer and heard that it had the air option, multiple needle option and it was the DIGITAL Gentronics, the re-sale price was adjusted upward. So, you have to take things like that into consideration to understand pricing.