Strategy of Working Mostly in Telogen

Hair Removal Methods Professional Electrolysis
1

I really apologize for creating a new topic. And I know that Michael Bono already answered me that this all come with an experience. But I would really appreciate your answers!
Dear Josefa, could you please describe your working strategy for “mostly in telogen body parts” as on your photos of arms.
You posted photos of girls’s arm, whose hairs (80%) were mostly in telogen.

http://www.hairtell.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/83517/2.html
And I promise that it will be my last question about telogen-anagen hairs (I do not want to bother everybody anymore!)
Other electrologists are very welcome for their opinions.
So, my questions about strategy in working for “mostly in telogen body parts”

  1. Could you see only by vision observing that hairs (for example, on those arms) were in telogen? OR

  2. You felt the depth of hairs during insertion?

  3. If majority of hairs are in telogen, the insertion should be shallow. So, on what depth did you inset?

a) if always insert on anagen depth, if means that 80% of telogen hairs will be missed. Or you use blend method (or Multiplex or what) to catch telogen hairs as well?

b) if you always insert on telogen depth, insertion for 20 % of anagen hairs will be shallow, which can lead to cutting effect and ingrown hairs because of shallow inserting.

OR, as I mentioned already before, with great experience an electrologist can

  1. visually determine anagen and telogen hairs
  2. and feel the bottom of the follicle.

I would really appreciate you description of strategy working in mostly telogen hairs (I’veread that mostly body hairs are in telogen)

Thank you!

2

“And I promise that it will be my last question about telogen-anagen hairs (I do not want to bother everybody anymore!)”

Personally, this issue does not bother me. In fact, your curiosity amuses me, because I think you are one of the few who refuse to accept the “rules” established.

I will try to answer all your questions, but will be tomorrow, because today I had an overdose of telogen hairs in direct real. :wink:

3

1)Yes, the hairs in this arm had not been touched months ago. Thus most of the hair had reached the telogen phase. The waiting time coincided with the summer, and my client need to hide a little hair, so she bleached. In the picture you can still see the bleached hair from root to tip (these hairs have not moved since the area was bleached, a couple of months ago the picture). This could be a first clue. The second track is in the appearance of the stem near the root. I found this picture where you can see the difference.
[img:center]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-XDCqKGtVM8c/Tzao_9gZUdI/AAAAAAAABvk/abgWydGa3Jc/s426/11pezon_ampliacion%2520telogen%2520v.JPG[/img]

The thickness in the hair shaft decreases as it approaches the ostium (mouth of the follicle).

Many of the hairs in that arm (shown above) have no medulla, so the reduction in diameter can not be appreciated, however we still lack of pigment. This is the key to the hairs that had lost bleaching.

In these two videos you can see the difference in the insertion for different depths.
In the first, all of the hairs are anagen. The second most were telogen.

4

Thank you very much for your answer and video links!
But I see that you insert rather deep in telogen hairs as well (3 mm – 4mm, I guess?)
And the insertions are deeper in the first video of anagen hairs (4-5mm), Right?
Also, I guess that Laurier probe helps a lot to feel the bottom of the follicle.
You are doing amazing work, Josefa! I am shocked that you can work with your bare eyes on body areas (as I’ve read you wrote one time…)! I think that I will see the difference between these anagen and telogen hairs only using microscope!

5

Thank you. No Ekade, I need to use the binoculars to work almost all the time, now. Presbyopia is raging in my view, you know, age does not forgive.

I see that you insert rather deep in telogen hairs as well (3 mm – 4mm, I guess?)

Yes, this is a matter of safety, and to cover all the transient part if by chance at the right time, some follicles were developing a new anagen hair.

And the insertions are deeper in the first video of anagen hairs (4-5mm), Right

Yes. In these follicles, we are certain that we must destroy the transient part.

6

Thank you very much for your reply! It is exactly what I wanted to know! That it is safer to insert a little deeper than shallower.
Because in the chart, which t4ngent provided it looks that the insertion should be shallower.
http://www.hairtell.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/94321/Useful_visualization_of_follic.html#Post94321

7

[b]"Each follicle that produces hair has its own growth time variation. The anagen phase consists in three steps described as follows: the early anagen phase, the median phase, and the late anagen phase.

[color:#CC0000]At the early anagen phase, the follicle is not as deep and distorted. The bulb is very easy to reach and is located near the bulge.[/color]
(Ref.: Gior. Gino. Modern Electrology)
The median growth phase contains all the germ cells necessary for hair growth. Since the follicle is deeper and hydration is at its maximum, it is the best time to perform thermolysis techniques.
At the late anagene phase, the bulb reaches its characteristic form. It ages, starts dehydrating, keratinizing, and gradually detaches itself from the papilla and follicle external sheath. It is slowly growing into the catagen phase.

There are three reasons why an electrologist should remove hair during the early anagen phase:

to be able to reach the bulb in the case of naturally curly hair
to be able to reach the bulb in the case of a distorted follicle (the hair was pulled out without considering in which direction it was growing)
to better reach the papilla and the bulge, which are close to each other at this phase

We know that it is very difficult to insert a probe in a distorted follicle in the late anagen phase. In such a case, the effectiveness of the treatment is minimal since it is almost impossible to reach the papilla. Most of the time, there is a resistance when pulling the hair or the current simply cuts the hair. Finally, the same hair can cause folliculitis or reappear in the late anagen phase or even in the catagen phase. Since at the early anagen phase, the hair is less distorted and not as deep, we are sure to reach the bulb without difficulty and to obtain better results whatever technique is used.

Also, according to recent research on human follicles, it has been demonstrated that the bulge as well as the bulb contain germ cells responsible for hair growth. So, to permanently remove hair, both areas have to be destroyed, and the best way to do so is during the early anagen phase."[/b]

[img:center]http://www.anticancer.com/PNASfig-1.jpg[/img]

Ekade, Look carefully at the image of anticancer.com and read this article by Louise Levesque and tell me, do not fail something here? I’ll give you a hint, the electrologist needs a hair guide to insert the probe.

Better, ask otherwise. As the image above (this is not a drawing, is pure science), what stage the bulge is closer to the bulb?

8

I have about 100 unused drawing that were going to go in an (unfinished) book. This EPS shows a vellus hair “converting” to a terminal hair. Notice in the last drawing the vellus and terminal hair together, showing relative size. Electrologists can easily determine if a hair is “intermediate” (aka “shooter”), and these are probably the hairs that can get stimulated from laser. Point: these hairs might have been accelerating and becoming terminal anyway? However, laser probably reduced the growth time. (Just conjecture.) Hope this converted drawing works …

1 Like
9

Oh yes, please use this if you wish …

10

Michael, would be great if you could draw a picture with all phases of the follicle, including exogen and kenogen, the only two damn phases that prevent the electrologist have a 100% result in the first clearance.

11

I have a bunch more … how’s this one?

12

PERFECT!. This is where we can clearly see the times when there is NO hair guide (3 and 4). According to recent research, a phase that has gone unnoticed by most, kenogen phase. Is the phase in which the follicle is completely empty for a long time, something similar to what happens after the laser when the laser was less effective than it initially appeared to be.

13

I have a newer drawing that shows EXOGEN, but I can’t convert the damned thing. It was, however, on the cover of the Calif Newsletter. You can see all these newsletter for free if you go to the California electrology website.

Busy morning … I’m going to the beach for a nice walk with the seals (they are barking and driving me crazy!) Maybe they think it’s spring and are looking for females? Ark Ark Ark!!!

14

Michael, you can email it to me, I will convert it if I can.

15

I converted the bloody thing … it was in color, but would not do it … so this is the best I can do:

Exogencopy.jpg288×574

16

I’ve experienced this. IPL gave me false impression and then suddenly worse hair than before !

17

Thank you very much Josefa and Michael!
I did read Louise Levesque article. She advice to work in early anagen. But to be able to work in early anagen, a person should wax before electrolysis treatment.
Franklly, I do not know what to think about it because waxing can cause ingrown hairs and can distort follicles.

18

There are different opinions about this subject.

I work on people who shave, people who have waxed before their first electrolysis session and people who present with untouched hair in its natural state. I still get them finished within 9-18 months if they follow the schedule I suggest and their body is not tapping follicles to grow new hair. For some of my peach fuzz cases, I am still seeing a few clients that have hit the three year mark because they want it ALL gone, from cheekbones to clavicles.

19

Dee, do you personally have any preferences on what hairs to work? Shaved, waxed or untouched?

20

No, I don’t care, except if I am working on peach fuzz. I would prefer to see it in its natural state. If someone waxes their back prior to the first session, it is fun to get all those returning anagen hairs or to release some ingrowns. I certainly DON’T want them to wax after they start electrolysis, but doing this prior to the first session help synchronize hair growth and impacts the outcome very little.

Another point - there are many situations where people need to control the hair so as to disguise the fact that they have too much hair until I can get them to full clearance and regularly maintain that. I certainly sympathize with the woman that has a full beard and needs to shave between appointments and I am able to work on them in 24 to 36 hours after they shave. Guess what? They get permanent hair removal in a 9-18 month timeframe, with the average being 15 months. That is how it goes from my side of the fence, ekade. I take a pretty relaxed approach, all while respecting what others think is best to do, because I am focusing on the timeline to completion.