REPORT LASER HAIR STIMULATION

Hair Removal Methods Laser hair removal
#41

It seems we are all in general agreement that laser can be an acceptable option for some consumers, and electrolysis can be an acceptable option for some consumers.

No method is perfect for everyone, and practitioner skill is important.

It also stands to reason that professionals who focus on one method over another have reasons for doing so, and may wish to defend their method against criticism.

I don’t mind criticism backed up by facts, and I don’t mind strong but polite disagreement, but we are treading a little close to being uncivil. I consider civility an aspect of professionalism, and I hope everyone will conduct themselves accordingly.

If anyone feels they are being personally attacked or that the sniping is getting too aggressive, please let me know and I will take appropriate action.

Everyone is welcome to share their experiences here. Picking fights is not going to end well for those who choose not to be civil.

#42

Another report of laser causing hair to wake up?

"Trailrider
Member

Registered: Fri Feb 01 2013
Posts: 4

So I posted in the laser forum that I had 4 treatments with the Lightsheer Duet on my back and shoulders and all the hair has grown back. Not only that, but the hair on my upper arms actually got thicker. Someone said I should try electrolysis but maybe I am a bad candidate, maybe I’ll be wasting my time with electrolysis too? How do I know? I don’t want to waste any more money."

Any laser experts that would like to comment on this case and offer guidance to this poster?

#43

I had just written a few paragraphs but the power went out :confused:

Attempt #2

Typically if there is an issue with the laser (burn, complaint) the clinic can call the laser manufacturer with ?'s. They usually recommend 2 things: getting the laser serviced and following the manufacturer’s laser settings guidelines. They DO NOT accept any responsibility for any harm, lack of results or induced hair that comes to users and clients.

Burns are the # 1 issue due to lawsuits. Laser induced hair is not accepted or acknowledged as something real to them even tho I’m almost 100% positive they have had complaints or at least questions regarding it from laser owner/operators.

I wouldn’t worry too much about all the denial of laser induced hair growth lasting for too much longer. Once someone sues for laser induced hair the research will be happening. It will be proven it exists. How can a lady get a single pulse for 1 coarse hair on her chin 7 times and her results are now 10+ coarse hairs in a 9mm patch. If this was hormonal, she would have hairy patches all over her face.

With laser burns once someone sued, others jumped on the bandwagon. In the early yrs of laser (mid 90’s), clients mostly accepted that burns from a ruby laser was a part of the risk of being “hair free”. That didn’t last for long when people realized they could get $$$. This I’m sure, rapidly changed the amount of research for safety and improvements towards making lasers safe for darker skins= reduction of burn lawsuits and liabilities.

There will be people who will want compensation for leaving the laser clinic hairier than when they walked in.

Time will tell the truth.

#44

Copied and pasted from another thread:

#108225 - Sat Aug 03 2013 12:47 AM Re: Should I go back to Laser? [Re: samukas]
atticusfata
Member

Registered: Tue Jul 09 2013
Posts: 2
Loc: Texas
I feel like I am in the same situation as you kinda. I went in for laser exactly a year ago and did treatments for full back and chest and stomach. I didn’t think I needed it for my back because I had a lot of fine hair and some thick hair in certain areas which I called an electrolysis to take care of that but was turned away because she didn’t do large areas anymore >:( but anyways I thought laser was great at first, I was having less hair each time and I was really satisfied with the results and after about 8 treatments in the back and about 10 in the front I didn’t think I needed anymore. I was getting treatments about every month sometimes a month and a half with a machine called Apogee Elite laser. Well after the treatments I had about 10 times the amount of growth on back and on shoulders.Front I would say a little better chest maybe 10% better, stomach idk if I can tell a difference or not maybe a little better too I can’t recall to be honest.

I am now looking into calling around to find an electrolysis for the front as far as the back I think I’m screwed there is too much hair now. I’m not sure what to do. For you I would say electrolysis at least you know that is permanent : /

How do you shave your back btw?

#45

Gender: Female

Age: 27

Date you started treatment: 9/15/12

Hair color: Brown (dark brown)

Color of Skin: Olive, Caucasian Italian & Colombian

Hair Structure: Fine but Dark hair

Area(s) treated: Sideburns

Name of LASER or IPL : CandelaLASE

Treatment settings: Spot Size 18, wavelength 15, Pulse duration m/s 3, DCD 30/20

Skin reaction: Redness, small amount of swelling

Shedding? Yes

Did you report increased hair growth to your laser specialist? yes

When I began laser hair removal in NYC I was not correctly, or strongly advised that Laser works best on very coarse dark hair, such as pubic hair and NOT well on the very thin but DARK sideburn hairs. In the beginning I thought I had great resutls. By the 3rd and 4th session I was beginning to noitce WAY more hair per square inch appear in areas beyond treatment. For example, the laser was only administered close to my ear lobe and hair was stimulated going outward from the ear to the side of my cheek, and downward twords my lower jawline. After 8 sessions i quit, and let my hair grow in. I do not have PCOS. I know my body, I know my hair and LASER stimulated my hair growth. In my opinion, unless you have manly pubic hair on your face do NOT get laser on your face.

(I have had my lower back done with good results, and underarms down with amazing results from the same place, same technician.)

#46

Just wondering if a technician can chime in on this but would it have something to do with the frequency of the “laser” light that is pulsed?

#47

Name of LASER or IPL : CandelaLASE

Treatment settings: Spot Size 18, wavelength 15, Pulse duration m/s 3, DCD 30/20

CandelaLASE isn’t a laser, in which case I’m assuming you meant GentleLASE. Wavelength of 15 makes no sense (wavelength would be 755nm on that machine), so maybe you meant joules, except 15J doesn’t exist on the GentleLase for 18mm spot size, so basically we don’t know what the strength of the settings were.

#48

Gender: Female

Age: 26

Date you started treatment: Last year. However, the affected area (under the chin) was stimulated in 3 sessions only.

Hair color: Dark brown

Color of Skin (Skin type can be relative, so pictures are much better. It would be much better, and more scientific if we had clear photos of the area being treated before, and the same area after. Close up would be nice- so as to be able to clearly see the hair color and thickness): Pale. (I will try to update with pictures eventually)

Hair Structure: The hairs that “sprouted”? Some of them are thin and blond, others are thin and darker and a select few are a bit thicker.

Area(s) treated: Upper lip and chin. However, the area that resulted in trouble was the area under the chin, which they should have left alone to begin with since I had no hair there.

Name of LASER or IPL (Make, and model of laser, date of manufacture, and software revision- this will give a more clear indication of the particular system’s capabilities.): Alexandrite laser by Candela

Treatment settings (Complete treatment parameters including Energy/cm2, pulse width, repetition rate, cooling method, spot size, and number of passes (if more than one).

I have no idea whatsoever. I was told it was set to the highest settings according to my skin type in the last session, though. What that is I have no idea.

Skin reaction: Fairly normal, thankfully. Some swelling and redness on the first day. Some minor red areas on the second day. Never had any trouble.

Shedding? There was some dark spots in the week after treatment.

Did you report increased hair growth to your laser specialist? Definitely and they gave all kinds of excuses: from being hormonal (gonna have some blood tests done just to confirm) from the age factor. I am 26 and never had any hair under my chin before these laser sessions.

Before and After pictures? I will update with the results. Unfortunately I don’t have any close up of “before”.

#49

It is a good idea to have some consultation and test treatments at both clinics. Hopefully Josefa from Malaga will read this thread, she may have some knowledge of electrologists in Portugal.

#50

Thank you for your reply.

After some more research yesterday I found another electrologist, one hour away from where I live. They have studied in Canada and they use the Apilus equipment, which I have watched a video of on Youtube someone linked to here in the forums. I am glad a solution is seeming ever more possible for this, I just need to be patient =)

#51

Here are some pictures I took of my chin. This is 7 weeks after laser:

http://tinypic.com/r/hv9yew/5

http://tinypic.com/r/iz2mbq/5

http://tinypic.com/r/20h7rky/5

#52

Hard to tell much without “before” pictures.

#53

[color:#000099]Gender: Male

Age: 24

Date you started treatment: Febb 2013

Hair color: Black

Color of Skin: Brown

Hair Structure:

Area(s) treated: Back/ Shoulders/ Arms

Name of LASER or IPL: Nd: YAG

Treatment settings, if known:

Skin reaction:

Shedding? after 4/6 weeks

Did you report increased hair growth to your laser specialist?

I’m trying to figure it out

Before and After pictures?

Pre session 1:

Pre session 2:

Pre session 3:

Other comments.[/color]

I’m considering whether I should go for another treatment session. I can say for sure that I have seen a reduction on my forearms (40%), however I believe that I may be experiencing induced hair growth on upper arms, and can’t be sure about my back.

Any opinions to help me decide on whether to go for another appointment will be very helpful.

#54

Hi.

Adam89, what skin type are you?

Why did you used an ND:YAG and not an Alexandrite laser?

Do you know the settings that used on you (spot size, joules)?

Thx.

#55

Gender: Male

Age: 26

Date you started treatment: Feburary 2013

Hair color: Black facial hair, body hair; hair on my head is dark brown.

Color of Skin: Naturally, I’m Olive-skinned but very tanned since I lived in FL since '09.

Hair Structure: Not sure. My facial hairs are SOOO thick and close together. To make an illustration, imagine rubbing on sandpaper - that’s what my hairs on my chin feel after a day or two of not shaving.

Area(s) treated: Face (cheeks, chin, jaw, neck)

Name of LASER or IPL: Candela

Treatment settings I’m unfamiliar with, but in regards to my problem (the chin hairs that can’t be zapped) my technician goes over those spots twice!

Skin reaction: My face appears red for the rest of the day and I get small bumps, but it all disappears the following day at night. I have clear skin, thankfully.

Shedding? Nothing noticeable.

Did you report increased hair growth to your laser specialist? Oh, yeah.

Before and After pictures? I can’t upload pictures here on my iPhone…

I first started treatments in Feburary 2013 at South Florida’s only facility with a lifetime guarantee (unlimited treatments). I’ve done a total of twenty-one treatments and counting, to date, on my face and I’m still going. Before I started treatments, my whole face was basically sandpaper - now it’s smooth as ever, except on my CHIN - there’s two fairly large patches on both sides that are still sandpaper-like and thick, coarse hair that are dot-like and close together. It’s like rubbing on sandpaper (my dad had the same issue).

Everywhere else on my face has proven successful, though I do feel stimulation on my mustache (stubbly hair that won’t grow out), a few fine thin hairs that barely grow on the side of the cheek. At this point, I don’t care if hairs grow back so long as it’s fine hairs (though I’m skeptical if I shave, I’m back to square one). My main goal now is to get rid of those patchy areas on my chin. A lot of people think it’s a birthmark, others seem shocked that I’m only able to grow hair on the side of my chin - this has forced me to always shave - my hairs grow back insanely fast.

I’m just learning the fundamentals of LHR and for years I’ve been so self-conscious of my own hairs that I’ve decided to make a career as a laser technician (I study alternative health). On February 2015, I’ll be set for my first electrology appointments, let’s hope that it can get rid of these hairs.

#56

Female, late 20th.

Laser: GentleLase, spot size 20 mm, energy 12 j

Area: Chin

Never had any hair on my neck or on that area between the jaw line and the neck – not sure about the terminology…) Stupid laser tech wanted to seem generous and in addition to my chin lasered the area under the chin and the portion of the neck. I stopped her when it was too late (the spot size was 20 mm and with just a few zips she covered a lot). Result: now I’m struggling with those ugly hair on my under-chin area which are very difficult to remove with electrolysis (hair grow in different weird directions and skin is so thin that the needle breaks it and the area bleeds…((

P.S.: Is there a “black list” of bad clinics on the website? – I’d be glad to add that clinic (every treatment with them was a major screw up)

#57

There is a position of strong overstretching where this area can easily be reached. Not too comfortable (i know it also as a client of electrolysis), but highly efficient. No bleeding - which should only occur for at most a few stitches and is in most cases a mistake of the electrologist - and thanks to the stretching of the skin and the fact that it is thin the energy can often be greatly reduced without losing any efficiency.

#58

Thank you! So it’s most likely the electrologist’s mistake? I suspected that she was probably doing some things wrong. I even created a separate topic www.hairtell.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/119155/chin:_weekly_treatment.html

Could you please explain what mistake is that? Is it the angle she inserts the needle at creates the bleeding or something else?

She also told me that she buys the cheapest needles that are not very good.

#59

No, there isn’t a “black list” on bad clinics on this website.

Over the years we have heard these kind of complaints.

I tell my clients not to lase their faces and necks. Too risky for laser hair stimulation. Whatever hair is stimulated, though, can be treated permanently by an electrologist. People do resent spending more money and using their time to go through the electrolysis process, since they thought laser hair reduction would be the answer to their problem.

Sorry you had this happen to you.

#60

Laser is good for female hair legs bikini under arms, electrolyisis is good for male prone hair like upper lip chin around the nipples anything that is brought on by male testosterone or too little osetrogen.
Using temp meathods on these can end up stimulating the hair, electrolysis offers reduction not perminant unless you kill these hairs they will grow back more like weeds.

Another think to consider is the probe size electrolysis uses an extremely thin neddle to go into each individual hair follicle to kill it, when using a laser probe you are hitting area’s where there are no hairs or the hair is too light in order to treat an area which has dark hair, those areas are going to get stimilated, this is why it needs to be a thick bushy area like bikini and legs under arm to work best.