Probes?

Hair Removal Methods Professional Electrolysis
1

I was thinking about buying my electrolysis some insulated probes to use on me. I just wanted to know if it is a good idea and would even be worth it?

right now she uses gold sterex probes which are supposed to be really good and cause less irritation to the skin. But my skin still scabs and is red after treatment so i am wondering if i should make her try insulated probes on me? I hear they only target directly to the follicle and don’t cause irritation to the surrounding tissue which helps with less chance of scarring and less healing time “scabs”?

Let me get some input here guys… Thanks :slight_smile:

2

The affect of insulated probes depends on which mode you are using. Insulated probes will have a bigger affect with galvanic current and/or the galvanic part of blend. The DC current will not conduct through the insulated part of the needle so the current will be focussed at the end of the needle. The thin layer of insulation does little to block the high frequency current in thermolysis or the HF part of blend. This is called capacitive conduction or capacitive coupling. However, both here and in the text books it is stated that one needs to kill at least 2/3 of the folicle so I am not sure what the point of insulated needles really is. I have read that by forcing the current deeper, you get less pain from the surface skin layers but if this reduces the kill rate its not really helping. If you have metal sensitivity (uticaria) like my wife, the insulated needle would reduce the amount of metal contact so that might be helpful. I think that at the end of the day, you just have to try them and see if they work better or worse for you. Also, if you are doing galvanic or blend, I think some of the scabbing is due to the lye which you will get with any needle type.

3

Although i’m not a guy:

First of all: with one single exception, insulated probes are intended solely for use with thermolysis, not for blend.

There are many more factors affecting the focusing of the signals (both HF and galvanic), most notably the diameter of the probe and and also obviously the shape of the tip. The latter ist different on sterex 2-piece, sterex one-piece and ballet, sterex two piece being the roundest. In direct comparison, my clients prefer ballet probes and explicitly reject sterex 2-piece due to noticeably higher sensation.

Regarding insulation: about two weeks ago i tested sterex insulated probes (both one and two piece, sizes 2 and 3), using flash thermolysis. Result: the insulation wore off after treating a few hairs, up to the length where treatment had to be effective. If some galvanic is present as well, the insulation of the probes wears off immediately.

The insulation of the ballet probes i use quite frequently is usually much more stable - despite a tendency of the insulation toward spalling off, especially (and not much surprising) of the insulation of size 2 probes during longer treatments.
This sudden change of the character of the probe has a clear effect on the usability of the probe - treatment feels different for me as a practitioner. Despite the effect of capacitive coupling, also the shape of the thermolysis signal is affected, especially if i use short signals.

Currently i am switching back and forth between insulated and non-insulated probes, mostly ballet in all available thicknesses and have to figure out what is to be preferred for the specific client by trial and error. Sometimes insulated probes work better, sometimes blank probes. I still do not have a clear model on the specific conditions, but on current impression my results appear to be better with insulated probes if the follicle (actually the isthmus) is less elongated than average and non insulated is superior if the isthmus is comparatively long and narrow.

One thing should be noted:
insulated probes always concentrate the energy toward the tip, at least to some extent. Therefore, the danger of producing ugly residuals (tombstones, even worse crippled hair growing from the uppemost rest of the former isthmus, is larger when insulated probes are used).

Referring to the initial post: this means that it might be counterproductive urging an electrologist who is used and therefore skilled to use plain probes to use certain different probes she is not used to, especially if these are insulated.

4

The information on insulated needle application is inconsistent and confusing. Here is a quote from Hinkel & Lind:
“Coated needles were and are an attempt to solve the problem of surface overtreatment. They are more effective with galvanic currents than with high-frequency because the high-frequency field is not affected by the insulation. There is some reduction of the high frequency heating, however, because the additional coating spaces the tissue away from the needle.”

Ballet does not seem to have a website with application info but the Instantron website says this about Ballet insulated needles:
“Should you desire to use the Ballet Insulated Sterile Disposable Electrolysis Needle for Blend or Galvanic treat- ments, rest assured that the insulation will withstand the effects of lye or even the longest treatments.”

whereas the Sterex website says:
“Suitable for Short Wave Diathermy only”

In the article “Electroepilation using insulated needles”
“We were able to destroy the hair papilla using a long-duration, high-frequency current while protecting the skin surface from scarring by using an insulated needle”

Since I am a PhD electrical engineer, I can say that the passage from Hinkel is physically correct. It is hard to make much sense from the needle manufacturer’s scanty website data. If there is a generallly accepted source covering which type of needle is used for what, I would love to see it. My sense is that needle application is partly lore, partly art, and partly experience.

5

Since i am a PhD geophysicist, i can completely follow. If this were not the case, thermolysis with insulated probes would not be possible at al: the tip would just destroy the tissue punctually, and tissue above the uninsulated tip would be left intact. Consequence: the hair will not be fully treated.

Being also an electrologist, i do notice (subtle) differences toward otherwise identical uninsulated probes using (flash) thermolysis, especially with the small sizes. Therefore we need a physical explanation for that (secondary?) effect.

As a first idea: the insulation has a final thickness, which is not neglectable in practice, at least with the thinnest probes. Hence the fields acting on the skin are somewhat different. And this is be noticeable, at least under conditions where the signal acts only a fraction of a second.

My sense is that needle application is partly lore, partly art, and partly experience.

My experience tells me that we have to consider also second or maybe third order effects, at least when we try to achieve more than just getting the hair off (e.g., getting it off and minimizing unpleasant side effects like pain or the amount of tissue to be destroyed.)

6

Depending on what the insulation material is made of, it would be reactionary to the lye produced by blend and galvanic. Some manufacturers make an insulated that is certified for blend as well as thermolysis

7

While you might politely ask your electrologist to try insulated needles for your treatments, please keep in mind that some epilators do not perform well with insulated needles. The resulting blast from the tip of the needles does rise to the surface and does the opposite of what you are hoping to accomplish.

Redness should be expected after a treatment and some scabbing can be expected.

Assuming that you have talked to your electrologist about all of the reactions you are having and what you would like to change about those reactions - has the electrologist indicated that epilator settings have been tweaked? Are you one of those delicate skinned individuals who has a thin moist skin?