Thanks Mike Roy, I’m eager to try.
For those interested, Mr. Roy is designing a new probe that will allow us to insert the IBP as fast as with a probe of a piece.
Thanks for listening, and responding to our needs.
The last batch you sent me performed well.
having less bend in the inactive portion of the probe is a big help.
Question about length of insulation.
I recall that before IPB Josefa did not use insulated probe at all saying that 2 mm insulating is not enough to kill most hairs.
And James used gold probes mainly.
Probably I should read the whole thread, but it is so long!
So, can I ask this question here?
I am asking all electrologist who use IBP.
Do you make two pulses (one at papilla and one at the bulge) using IBP to kill the hair since it is an insulated probe compared with not-insulated probe?
Thank you!
In his book, Michael explains very well a phenomenon that occurs with HF. The point effect.
The energy is concentrated at the tip of the needle, even when a needle does not have insulation layer.
Look at this picture, it is a photo taken from one of the DVDs by Dr. James Schuster (I’m probably breaking some law of copyright, so if I end up in jail, someone pass me a file 
).
The picture shows a comparison test between 3 needles. A non-insulated, an insulated and insulated bulbous Laurier. Look at the pattern of heat each, in the Laurier the white coagulated area is denser, is more defined and rises a little more. This is because you need to work with less intensity. If the follicle is in telogen, a larger heat pattern covers the base and the bulge with a single pulse. In an anagen follicle, you will need two pulses at different levels.
I should point out that Dr. Schuster applied only 30% of the power applied to the bare needle, to the IBP for that picture.
Probe diameter choice is made primarily by the diameter of the hair in question. As you can imagine, the diameter and the vertical height of the treatment zone required, grows progressivly larger in proportion to the hair. However, a sampling of the hairs in a given area will show hairs in various stages of growth and therefore various depths and bulge sizes. Our tip lengths are chosen to cover most circumstances for the type of hair being treated. A hair that is out of proportion to the average in the area being treated, may require expanding the treatment area more in the vertical dimension. That would require placing the tip at the bottom, pulsing, then raising the Probe a bit to deliver a second pulse. This technique allows the operator to adapt to variations for each hair.
The operator chooses the diameter to match the average and we choose the tip length to be proportional to fit the average hair of that size. Movement of the Probe allows immediate adjustment by the operator outside those parameters.
Thank you! That’s what I was asking! Would be great to hear other electrologist opinion!
Like Josefa, i use a single pulse in a telogen follicle and double pulse in anagen.
S/ Tehfe, what is your strategy distinguishing telegon hairs and anagen hairs?
By lack of pigment? Or you can feel the bottom of the follicle? With Laurier probe many said it is possible to feel it.
I use Laurier probe and I have to admit I have never felt the bottom of a follicle with any probe I have used. For me it is observation and intuition.
I cant say I normally feel the bottom of the follicle either. I have inserted on myself carefully, slowly with high magnification, super slow, gentle, you name it and it is still possible to keep going when you know you are well below the follicle. There isn’t even a sting or pain when you get right in there. I have sunk the probe right in to the taper and still nothing. All on myself I hasten to add.
Can you feel the infundibulum at least?
Feeling the bottom of the follicle varies from practioner to practioner! I’m sure there are a few of our colleagues who can feel it and some who can not. It’s all about sensitivity varying from person to person.
Michael Bono in “The Blend” said on pg 29 said that he could “never feel the bottom of the follicle”. I’m sure we all consider Michael to be one of the best!!
Anyone else who can’t feel the bottom of the follicle out there ?! LOL
Ugh! If only it would be possible to invent some safe kind of light/rays to see inside the skin!*wink! Like X-rays, but safe!
Dreams!*smile!
I can’t feel the bottom of the follicle either, I choose the depth based on experience/intuition. The only time I do feel a bottom is on a poor insertion where it goes off into a sebaceous gland or something, that hurts…
I used to start with a deeper pulse and then pull up and pulse again, but more recently I started using a single pulse higher up to target the bulge area. With proper placement most hairs can be killed with a single pulse, on very coarse anagen hairs or any that don’t pull out I deliver another pulse at the same area.
Since the signaling proteins which initiate follicle development/cycling and the connections which hold the follicle in place are both located at the bulge area, I see no compelling reason to target energy in the lower portion of the follicle. Even if you don’t fully coagulate the area at the base, it will usually pull out with the rest as long as the bulge area has been sufficiently coagulated and not dessicated.
The most important part in your strategy, I believe, not to go too shallow. For example, if follicle depth is 5 mm, and you insert only 3 mm, I believe it will be too shallow. And shallow insertions will cause much more problem that if you will target papilla.
P.S. I very carefully examined many Josefa videos, and it seems that she never insert shallow. (Of course, she can correct me) In most videos the needle goes almost to all its length, rather deep.
And from client to client and on working speed. If i go really fast, i do usually not even try to feel the bottom of the follicle but do measure the follicle depth or regularly try to judge each treated hair - it usually comes out strongly curved below the position of the tip of the probe (as Michael pointed out in the section of his book on shallow insertions).
If you are a practitioner who says that you can not ever feel the bottom of the follicle, here is an exercise to try.
Select some hairs on your lower leg. It is probably best to choose the leg opposite of your dominant hand. Using the best magnification you have available, insert into a follicle with no treatment current in use (in fact, you can do this exercise without the probe even being plugged into the machine) and while using the lightest grip that keeps the probe from falling out of your hand, but still guides it into the follicle, SLOWLY slide the probe into the follicle, while taking special care to notice what you feel inside the follicle, from both the perspective of the person being probed, and the person inserting the probe.
Next, see if you can feel the point where the probe meets the anchor system of the hair. If you don’t feel this, you may be moving the probe too fast, or gripping the probe holder too tightly. If you are doing it correctly, with a light touch, the meeting of the anchor system should be all it takes, to make the probe start to slide out of your grip, as the barrier of the anchor stops the forward progress of the insertion. You will momentarily increase the grip on the probe to push past this barrier and lighten up again. As you push past the anchor, you will start to experience a warming sensation inside the follicle. This will become hotter as you get closer to the bottom of the follicle. Once again, the forward progress should slow and come to a halt without you tightening up your grip a bit. If you push past this bottom point, you will feel hot and then pain. Now, notice what your softly gripping fingers felt as you attempted this.
Try it again and again. Send me a Number 7 Jersey thank you gift in the mail for helping you improve your technique. 
If you can’t see well enough to make a good insertion to the follicle, it will be very hard to do this exercise.
I share your theory t4ngent. But only if the follicle is in telogen phase. If we are working in anagen, the bulb at the base of the follicle also must be coagulated. It is easier to feel the base if you are inserting into a follicle in anagen. In telogen, the base seems to be more permeable. Maybe because of a transient part “ghost”?
A second shot will increase the coagulated area and increase the heat pattern to the surface (even if you do not move the probe).
Ekade, in this sequence of images you can see how the probe “collides” with the base of the follicle in anagen. A sharp probe more easily pass through this wall than a bulbous probe. The bulbous tip is like an open umbrella.
Since I discovered the IBP, I have often expressed my admiration for the quality of this probe. I received rebukes from some of my colleagues because they are probably under pressure from their customers to use the “Laurier”. Apparently my behavior is little solidarity with my colleagues because this reduces the options to work with other probes that would do a similar job. My work ethic is being questioned. So I wonder what my colleagues think? and what think the customers have benefited from the discovery of the properties of the IBP? Should I keep my enthusiasm in “secret” to prevent that some colleagues feel pressured? Is not this (secrecy) that many northamericans reproached Mrs. Peters?.
On the other hand, if Michael Bono had not spoken of this type of “hybrid” probe (bulbous and insulated), I would never have known that there is. I used a IBP in the beard of this man. I could have used a gold probe or a insulated with standard tip, or a tapered, still the results would have been good, but I would not have felt so safe. It was necessary that the skin does not present visible side effects in 3 weeks from the start for him to return to his country of origin without trace of Electrolysis. So my options were quite limited. Fortunately, everything went better than expected. Thanks to the IBP? Honestly, I think so.
Who needs the fountain of youth? this guy has returned to his 15 years. And he has only needed a couple of weeks and Electrolysis!
Have a good trip back home. It was a pleasure meeting you!