Well, sort of.
I’ve been having LHR on my lower legs and bikini line. It’s been 7 weeks since my last treatment (I’ve had two so far) and my legs feel completely smooth, but from the side I can see that I have a LOT of very, very fine blonde hair. I know I’ll need electrolysis to get rid of it, but is this common or is the laser making my hair thinner AND blonder?
it’s common to notice the blonder hairs once the dark ones are gone. usually, when you shave, you shave all the hair off, so it’s hard to distinguish. plus, some of the hairs you might be seeing are just coming in and are very new and soft, so they look lighter when they’re actually very fine.
Also, do not forget, it is summertime, and your finer hairs may appear blonde.
Also, do not forget, it is summertime, and your finer hairs may appear blonde.
Chris,lagirl or sslhr:
Can any, or all of you explain exactly what permanent hair reduction means?
Does it mean that a certain percentage of hairs are gone -can’t be seen, won’t come back ever again?
Does it mean that a light-based system can partially “kill a coarse hair”, but when the same hair returns it will not be dark or thick like before, but rather thinner and a lighter in color?
If the hair that is seen after laser treatments is light and fine or even clear in appearence, does that mean the laser light caused this transformation or does it truly mean that those hairs were there before treatments, but we never noticed?
I’ve come to understand over the years that all of the above are true, but I’m now doubting myself after seeing some recent comments here.
Thanks,
Dee
I would say it means that most of the hair in an area can be removed, but there will always be some left that are too fine or too deep or too light etc.
If the hair comes back finer, the follicle might have been weakened but not killed. in that case, who knows whether it will become stronger with time again and will start producing hair that’s more coarse again.
i feel that most of the time, people just start noticing lighter hairs once the dark ones are gone. it happens with electrolysis too. you start removing the borthersome ones and once the area is more clear, the fine and lighter ones start to become more noticeable and annoying too 
I think there are a few rare instances where a few hairs are turned white after laser treatment, but it’s a temporary side effect and that hair falls out and starts growing in normal again later. it happened to a couple hairs on my underarm.
I think the better way to understand this, whether for electrolysis or laser, is to consider an individual hair and then aggregate it for all hair. But it is important to understand that the size and color of a hair is a function of the number of follicular cells and melanocytes (pigment cells) that are contributing to the growth of the hair.
When energy is put into a follicle, regardless of the means, several things can occur.
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The hair follicle can be destroyed. But this can mean one of two things. Either every cell was destroyed (which is less likely) or enough of the critical cells are destroyed such that the follicle will never regenerate and never grow another hair. Either way that hair is gone and there is a net reduction in hair.
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The hair is partially destroyed and enough of the hair is destroyed so that the hair can only partially regenerate. This is hair that will continue to grow but is lighter and finer than it was before. This is quite common.
An important issue here is whether there is a preferential destruction of one type of cell over another. In other words, would a melanocyte (the cell that produces melanin) be more likely to be destroyed compared to a normal follicular cell. There is no reason to believe it would be. Unlike a melanosome (which is a packet of melanin) a melanocyte has no pigment. Therefore its likelihood of being destroyed is only a function of its location within the thermal density or electrodensity produced by the mechanism of follicular destruction. In other words, there is no reason for it to be preferentially destroyed. If there is no likelihood for the melanocyte to be preferentially destroyed then there is no likelihood for the hair to lose all its pigment. What happens is that there is a net reduction in melanocytes and the hair looks lighter. If the type of melanin is a lighter melanin to begin with, then the hair may look even more light and even pigment free.
- The hair is partially destroyed but not enough of the right cells are destroyed to prevent the hair from regenerating. The question as to how long it takes for this to happen is not clear. The ongoing theory I’ve heard and to which I sort of subscribe is that within two cycles a hair that has not return will probably never return. But with human beings there is never 100 probability in something like this, so one never really knows.
Does this happen? Absolutely and probably accounts for the reports of hair growing back months after treatment. Lasers that have issues with the combination of wavelength, delivery, and settings are more likely to cause this giving an elusion of success to be then followed by bitter disappointment when the hair begins to grow back. And by the way, I am convinced that this also occurs with electrolysis. It is not just a laser issue.
- The follicle was not sufficiently heated to cause any follicular destruction. Either it was missed. Or the laser and/or settings or method of electrolysis used were not sufficient. Or the hair was too fine or too light or the wrong color to absorb enough energy. Or the technique (laser or electrolysis) was poor. And the hair continues to grow.
I think those are the major possible outcomes. Now aggregate that to the entire set of hair understanding that there will be many different kinds of hair in an area, fine young hair, old coarse hair, terminal hair, and vellus hair. One also needs to understand that the laser’s greatest strength is also its achilles heel; that it treats hair in aggregate and that is that it is only effective on the right type of hair. Luckily, most hair is the right type of hair but not all hair is. Furthermore, because one is treating hundreds or thousands of hairs at a time, the probability of individual hairs not being destroyed in a treatment is much greater than the probability of an individual hair being treated by electrolysis just because in electrolysis there is greater focus on an individual hair. And that, by the way, is electrolysis’ greatest strength and its achilles heel; that only an individual hair can be treated at a time.
So what does it mean permanent reduction? I’m not sure it is any different for lasers as it is for electrolysis. If someone comes in and treats their underarm 7 or 8 times they can get the same result (assuming the right kind of hair) as someone who comes in and does electrolysis on that same underarm for 20 or 30 hours. With electrolysis, some people will not be finished in 20 or 30 hours nor will some people be finished in 7 or 8 laser treatments.
But electrolysis (that is done right) can eventually get rid of all the hair if one continues long enough. And the exact same is true with lasers with one caveat, that there is the potential that there is hair which due to color and/or size and skin color can not be treated. And this untreatable hair by lasers is the source of all the confusion between permanent reduction and permanent removal.
Has anyone given any thought to adding artificial pigment (paint/dye) to the hair before laser treatment to increase efficacy? Since you could only die the hairs which were outside the skin, you might have to leave a small amount of stubble when treating, but it should in theory allow the naturally pigment-less hairs to conduct heat from the laser.
Though, I know hairs are good insulators, and I’m not sure if enough energy would reach the follicle in this case or if it would mostly dissipate to the surrounding tissue instead of running down the hair shaft into the follicle?
Just sort of thinking out loud…
yes, it has been tried already with meladine (run a search here on previous discussions). the problem is an obvious one. laser needs to be attracted to the root of the hair in order to disable the follicle and there is no safe way to dye the root.
Initially this theory was trotted out by one laser company (I will not mention ESC by name). And then I heard it repeated by numerous physicians and scientists though it is completely false. I still occasionally hear it mentioned as a mechanism for laser hair removal. Of course, what that fails to explain is why we don’t all die when the heat (or cold) is conducted into or out of our heads when the temperature is not just at 91 degrees.
Good for you for at least realizing that hair is an insulator and probably wouldn’t transfer the heat. Just that alone puts you above many of the “luminaries” in the field of lasers who have made a ton of money promoting malarky.
From what I understand, laser hair removal is permanent hair reduction. A properly performed and effective laser treatment will destroy all (targeted) hair follicles which are in the active growth stage. On subsequent visits there will be a different subset of follicles in active growth which will be targeted until a significant proportion (usually 80-95%) of the hair has been removed. These hair follicles are destroyed completely, and if the treatment is efective will never grow again.
This does not mean you will never grow hair in the area, it is natural for new hair follicles to form, especially if you are taking any medication or suffering from any condition which affects your hormone balance.
Many people will notice find blond/unpigmented hairs remaining in areas where they have had LHR. This is because many people (especially fair skinned individuals) have somethign like peachfuzz all over their body. In the absence of thicker, darker hair, these short fine hairs become more noticable but they do not grow more, or grow thicker than previously.
I hope that helps
-j