I have been receiving a form of electrolysis called the sub epidermal system. I was referred by a friend who with hirsutism who had been getting electrolysis for 28 years. With the SES, she achieved permanenency. The operator has a patent. She claims that there is an underlying infection, and that the hair is an appendage of the infection. I have been receiving treatment from her, on my chin and upper lip only, for 8 months, every 3 weeks. She charges $300 per hour. I have noticed a remarkable difference in my face–no more scars, decreased pores, etc. She says there are abnormal cells in the hair follicles which lead to the hairs. I have not yet achieved permanency in the area being worked on, but growth has slowed significantly. My friend has gone a year without a treatment.
This “system” is not electrolysis, it is an intense pulsed light, or “Flashlamp” treatment. It also does not advertise itself as “Permanent Hair Removal” the FDA only allows it to advertise itself as “Long Term Hair Reduction”.
If your practitioner has said that what she is selling at $300 per hour is Permanent Hair Removal, and you can prove that, you can strike it rich in a court of law with a fraud suit.
Please post your further experiences with this method in the Laser Hair Removal Forum.
I won’t even go into the “hair as appendage of infection” thing.
[ July 07, 2003, 07:46 PM: Message edited by: James W. Walker VII, CPE ]
It is electrolysis, with a needle. She has been practicing for 38 years and has taught electrolysis. She strongly believes hair removal is a medical necessity that should be covered by insurance, and that it is not cosmetic. She believes the hair is the result of an infection in the body, and that if it goes untreated, cancer may be the result.
Anything that causes sustained, increased blood supply to an area of the skin can cause increased hair growth, thickened hair growth, and even hair growth where none previoulsy grew. That is the only connection I can make to what you have said previously.
In your experience as an electrologist then, is it impossible to achieve permanency because there is always blood supply?
Electrolysis removes the path between the blood supply and the follicle. That’s why it works.
When you are doing electrolysis, does tissue ever come out behind the hair? My technician frequently brings up “abnormal cells” from the follicle. It can be quite bloody during the procedure but my skin looks great a few days later. Is this typical with electrolysis?
I have never had electrolysis where there was any bloody tissue removed…it isn’t necessary to see blood in order to get permanent results. Honestly, I cringe just thinking about it…
The only thing that should come out when electrolysis is performed is the hair and the epithelium of the follicle. There is nothing abnormal about this. If the treatment energy is just shy of perfect, the epithelium may turn inside out as the hair is epilated and appear to come out like a sock being turned inside out. You will only notice a clear deflated bag like object turned inside out on your skin.
Seriously, if your electrologist is pulling up any extra tissue past the epithilium she is coagulating the blood supply itself, and possibly the lower dermis. Would I be correct in assuming that she is utilizing thermolysis on a very high setting?
[ August 02, 2003, 08:53 AM: Message edited by: James W. Walker VII, CPE ]
There are times when my operator inserts the needle into a hair follicle and blood comes out of another follicle, without her even touching it. She says these are sister cells. She often brings up strings of blood from a hair follicle. She says that electrolysis done by an inexperienced operator can shatter cells and infect the bloodstream. She says she is removing these shattered cells and cleaning up the follicle. I don’t know what she does, if it’s thermolysis or not.
Very interesting. Carol, as you learn more about the treatment, I hope you will post the information. I have never heard of the sub epidermal system of electrolysis. The terms your operator are using I have never associated with electrolysis. If there are infections, why don’t doctors treat? Would the infection show up in a blood test? Do the infections ever fester? Quite a theory that is revolutionary and I would like to know more. It is wonderful that you are seeing results, but I wonder if it is just plain old electrolysis that has been permanent since 1875.
please also inform me if you get any solution.
I have reached a state of permanency I believe. After almost a year of treatments, I haven’t needed a treatment for over a month. I have no scarring. My skin looks great. She says she has a patent for her subepidermal system.
Make sure that you let us know your results after one year with no treatment, and then again with two years of no treatment.
A patent only means that no one else has tried to patent the idea yet. Did you know there is a patent on a styrofoam pyramid shaped razor blade holder that says that focusing “Pyramid Energy” resharpens the blades? Even if it works, the patent surely doesn’t mean that this person invented the pyramid shape.
[ August 13, 2003, 12:52 PM: Message edited by: James W. Walker VII, CPE ]