Hi everyone. I am a 28yr old male, with light skin and black hair. I’m getting laser hair removal on pretty much everywhere on my body, i have many questions, but for right now I’d like to focus on a question about my legs.6 weeks ago I had my first treamet on my legs treated with a gentle lase with 18mm spot size and 10j setting. I know this is low, and was told that the settings would be increased over time. My question is, in the past week I have noticed what is now very fine hairs growing on both my legs and thighs, the hair is not very close together and is not everywhere. What I would like to know is, is this laser induced hair growth, or is this hairs hat were missed by the laser. I had course dense black hair before, and have been satisfied with my 1st treatment as barely any hair has grown back. If I end up with fine hairs left after my treatments then I am fine with that, I’d just want it to look natural. I just dont want it to induce any more hair growth. I am going back for my 2nd treatment in less than a week so I need to know what to do or say to my laser tech. I will try and get a picture on here soon. Thank you everyone.
You will not get IHG on your legs, do not worry. 18/10 is low energy but it seems to have done the trick. Have them increase the energy to 14 joules if your skin can take it. Have them do a patch test first.
From what I understand you need the highest power your skin can take. Get them to do spot tests upto 20J.
Also, 6 weeksish is far too early for your second treatment. It should be around double that!
Im considering have just two treatments on my legs to give a bit of a reduction effect.
I want to know that hair removal by laser is safest way or it might be harmful.
I dont beleive that LHR has ever been proven to be safe, or unsafe either. I beleive that the jury is still out on this issue. Does anyone know otherwise?
The scientists among us will jump all over me on this one, but never mine.
Safety? Well, only long-term observation determines the actual safety of any device or procedure. I could quote a litany of surgical procedure that are (quietly) not done any more. Remember the “72-hour face lift?” (If you like I can explain this in depth).
X-ray hair removal was performed in the United States and Europe from the mid-1920s until (actual date) 1956! This was a painless procedure that removed hair permanently … and 100% of those getting the treatment died from cancer (usually thyroid). Am I saying that Laser causes cancer? Of course not. But we have still to see the actual safety of these devices proven over the decades.
Advertising from X-ray clinics stated that the treatment was “natural.” They said X-ray is all around us and “from the sun … a form of light energy.” (See the article in Hair Route.) Of course this is true, but the body does not “like” X-ray energy in amplified amounts and shot in a small area. Nobody knew.
I’m old enough to remember X-ray emitting fluoroscopes in shoe stores. Kids would put on a new pair of shoes and look at their foot bones under this device (that was left “on” and unshielded all the time!). OOOOPS! I guess we don’t have those any more. (I wasn’t allowed to do it.)
I have already posted that certain lasers have some effect on specific genes … and was “denounced” by an expert. Still what any expert cannot tell you is that laser is absolutely safe because it “has been in use for decades and there is no health problem.”
Electrolysis, however, can make such a statement. Electrolysis is basically a micro-burn. The human body has evolved for millions of years (or created by God … if you prefer), to deal with burns. It’s what the skin does … Decades of use prove that electrolysis (HF and DC) are completely safe. Completely!
Argue all you want about “laser safety,” but at this point it’s not a certainty because of the TIME element. Indeed, I have heard ALL the arguments concerning laser safety, and I could recite them myself (I suppose I’m going to hear them again?) And, that’s fine.
I have already noticed a couple distinct difficulties in the skin of patients that have had laser treatments. The surgeon I work with has confirmed these changes. Are they dangerous? We don’t know at this point. Like it or not (and disagree as you will) this IS the “new frontier.”
Did you know that side-effects from Laser Lasik (eyes) are only now showing up … 10+ years after the patient had the procedure?
What I do know for certain, is that the efficacy of laser is not simply based on a thermal burn. Something else is going on at a cellular level. (Again, a long explanation here.) And, to the theoretical scientists: you are not seeing what I’m looking at … for the last years.
Does anyone know if there is a national or international data base where physicians can report such changes specifically due to laser hair reduction? I would think that if there are observable problems, dermatologists would be reporting these problems at their conventions or to an agency, such as the FDA.
Laser has been around for over ten years and it cannot be compared to gamma radiation (XRay’s) because it is a different light spectrum. What you said, Mike is true about electrolysis, but it APPEARS that laser hair reduction is safe, too.
Michael - I think you are right. There is still a lot we do not know to make concrete statements either way.
A quick search brings up research like this, although it’s a bit old http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/lsm.1900030403/abstract
Dee you have misunderstood my post. I am not comparing laser to X-ray as being similar modalities. (Yeah, I expected somebody to do make this assertion.)
NO! I am saying, “Only time will tell.” All theory and expectations become subordinate to the decades of use that are necessary to state something is totally safe.
X Ray is Ionized radiation. Laser is a specific beam NON IONIZED radiation. Commercially available since 1995 ( 16 years ). No issues to date.
I agree Michael.
The laser has not been on the marked long enought to state weather it is 100% safe or not.
I wonder about other things as well… too much use of cellphones for example.
Electrolysis, however, has been around for ages 
Laser has been used for hair removal for more than 16 years. It was researched for 20 years before it was introduced to the consumer market. Is 36 years long enough to draw some conclusions? Do you trust PubMed? Go through the research studies on laser hair reduction since 2000 and you will see the word “safe” used in the conclusion part study after study. Are doctors, who are also researchers, scamming the public? If there are serious patterns of genetic mutations, would not the medical community share and report this after 36 years of laser hair reduction?
I’m not getting into a pissing match about this. The laser in use today were not used in 1975. For me, the jury is still out … probably safe, but I have my ears and eyes open.
Fair enough. I actually thought this was a friendly exchange about a concern that comes up periodically here on hairtell. Thanks for correcting my spectrum of light error.
“Are doctors, who are also researchers, scamming the public?”
One thing I’ve learned about doctors is that they are people too. Can they be involved in scams? My own personal experience is YES, absolutely. (Please don’t interpret this as meaning lasers are scams).
I worked with Dr. “P” when the “XXX-hour facelift” made its appearance. Initially, he was against the procedure but since “his patients wanted it and everybody else was doing it … well, why not?” (The doctor I work with now thought the idea was preposterous.)
Essentially, a fine monofilament is threaded into the side of your face down to, say, your mouth. There are tiny “fish hooks” (sorry, they really look like it), that, when the surgeon pulls back, they hook into the dermis (but usually the fat layer). The surgeon then ties them off and you have an “immediate face-lift.” Several of these lines can be inserted and create an “almost” face-lift. Looks great … doesn’t last.
Unfortunately, the hooks tear through the fat layer and your face ends up sagging in an odd irregular way. These can be removed (usually an incision in the cheek to pull them out in a downward direction).
So, I wonder: were the doctors “doing a scam?” Did they know this was a sketchy procedure? I was pretty sure this procedure wouldn’t work … and I certainly am not a doctor. Why did I figure this out and not them? Oh, maybe because they could charge a few thousand dollars for a 30-minute procedure? You think?
I think there are some people in every walk of life, every career, that are lured by the money reward. It’s about character and ethics, whether you are a roofer, baker, politician, dog breeder, surfer dude, electrologist, fish hook maker…
“Fish hooks” are to LIFT that which had fallen due to GRAVITY. Jowls are a perfect example of fat that dropped to the jaw line and below. Someone invented the procedure and others tried it out for whatever reason. They were not skilled at it but they did it anyway. That is not ethical as the docs first tries were actually an EXPERIMENT ON A HUMAN. He did it to wait and see if and what happened but got paid for it. Ethically he should not have charged for it as he could not even give any information on previous experience with it. He should have the patient sign a ful disclosure statement that explained he was “trying something new” for which there was no charge in order to be ethical and this MIGHT HAVE PREVENTED ANY FUTURE LAW SUITS IF IT DID NOT TURN OUT AS EXPECTED BY THE PATIENT. How would you like it if a doc did that to you?
We go to docs we do not know and the doc says,“get undressed and get up on the table”. Do you do that with other people you do not know well? The shingle and licensing procedure is all we have but that gives us the feeling of trust and protection. Some docs abuse it and sooner or later we hear about it in the local paper and his practice is ruined. I do not know what makes them “crack” like that. Thank G-d it does not happen often.
One doc I know very well told me his wife left him with 2 kids when she was forty. He knew why but could not do anything about it. He said she was a very bright, accomplished woman who was living in the shadow of her husband the “DOCTOR”. She was known as the doctor’s wife not as the whole woman she was. She wanted more from life. Money was not the issue. She was smart but could not express herself as the person she was. The doc was chief of the cardiac care unit in a big Boston Medical school with many professional friends. She was the doctor’s wife. She could not take it any longer so she left. I do not know how it affected his practice but we all have problems of some kind. How we handle them is what is important.
That sounds like a scene out of the 1960’s. Thankfully, today many women are free to pursue any career they desire. Aren’t over half of all medical school classes made up of women? What I observe today is women physicians marrying men physicians or women physicians marrying non-physician professionals or otherwise. The otherwise part might be a husband who stays home and cares for the kids. So, no time to be bored or neglected. Ah! Utopia! All is peaceful and all are fulfilled.
Yes and what a wonderful affect that has had on society with children dragged up by strangers and house prices priced risen to need two incomes to afford.
Anyone with a bit of intelligence would realise life was better in the 60s with clearly defined roles between the sexes.
I’m truly enjoying this thread. Echoing what has been said, I have found that the personal lives of the doctors I know are “train wrecks!”
One psychiatrist friend (specializing in family issues) has been married SIX times! Another (maybe my best friend), made a fortune in real estate, lives in a 9,500 sq foot house and (at my age) married a “trophy wife” (his third). Now getting a divorce, his “young X” is asking for $78,000 PER MONTH! (That includes $15,000 per month for “entertainment.”) I don’t know, maybe it IS Santa Barbara? It has become a place of insane wealth and odd behavior. (I remain a stolid working class guy, however).
My take is that these guys have spent years studying only their specialty and have not necessarily perfected any other skill or aspect of human behavior (certainly not personal relationships). All those they encounter also give them great deference and respect. These two “items” do not make them experts on everything. Yet, they often think they are experts in all areas! And, most of them have abysmal personal lives as a result. Yeah, basically “train wrecks!” These guys come to me for advice … sad really, because I haven’t a clue either!