Environ Ionzyme DF machine between treatments??

Hair Removal Methods Professional Electrolysis
#1

I’m getting electrolysis on my face about twice/three times a week in half hour sessions. The hair is sparse but thick, black, course and hanging on for dear life on my eyebrows, chin, sides, and neck. I really like my electrologist and I think she’s really good (based on reading the millions of threads on here relating to electrolysis) but my skin is taking a huge beating from the whole thing. Red bumps and little white heads and just overall upset skin. I’ve just starting putting tea tree oil and aloe vera on the areas which I guess helps.

A decent spa in my area gives these Environ Facials, which is the Environ skin care range (based on effective levels of Vitamin A and C) along with the Environ Ionzyme DF machine which uses Iontophoresis which involves the use of an electrical current to facilitate greater penetration of vitamins into the skin, and Sonophoresis which involves the use of sound waves to transport vitamin molecules through the skin.

Can/should I use this Environ DF machine facial combo between my electrolysis appointments in order to ensure proper healing and soothing of the skin and overall perfect skin by the end of all these aggressive electrolysis treatments?

Will the DF machine do anything to disrupt the permanent hair removal process?

Does anyone know much about this DF machine and how well it works?

Is an intensive amount of Vitamin A and C something I should be doing right now alongside my electrolysis appointments?

…And most importantly, can it stimulate hair growth?

#2

I am a big fan of “marathon treatments,” the type of thing James and Josepha (and I) do: “mega-treatment” — and then many weeks of leaving it alone. I’m not a big fan of weeks and weeks of 2 or 3 treatments per week. It’s about healing.

I have yet to get my Doc to commit to the idea, but in wound-healing there is an interesting principle. Inflammation, of course, turns on the wound-module and phagocytes get to work “eating up” the mess. Problem is, if the phagocytes are overly stimulated they can begin to “eat up” the wound collagen that has already been produced in the wound site — from your last treatment. What would be the overall result of your 3X per week treatment? Frankly, I do not know.

According to the literature, however, by continually starting up the wound-module you could be, in a sense, allowing the wound to heal, then taking it apart, and then healing it again. Macrophages that are stimulated by chemical mediators do not know exactly what to “eat” and what not to. (This is the way that laser gets rid of tattoos. But some unwanted scar tissue is also created. It’s a trade-off.)

If someone lives in Santa Barbara, and is not coming from out-of-town, I will only see them one time per week. I want to see the signs of inflammation pretty much gone before I “kick it up” again.

Again, all of this is not based on clinical data — I am only making an interpretation from the literature. My observation of poorly treated upper lips (too many treatment, or too long) illustrate, I believe, the development of vertical creases. Just a supposition. (Dr Schuster agrees with this, by the way.) I say, forget the “machines” and let the area calm down before going at it again. No facial or machine is going to MAKE your skin heal better. You can’t beat nature. Maybe have longer sessions and then leave it alone!

#3

Note: Iontophoresis, by the way, uses the negative pole (DC) and causes more inflammation. I’d stay away. Save your money and go out and have a great meal.

#4

Thanks so much for the information and I have been trying to change areas on my face/body every time I go see my 1 out of 3 electrologists on hand so that they don’t treat a recently treated area. I would most definitely have longer sessions if I could but in New Zealand you can’t always get what you want! So I have to take what I can get (hence the 3 electrologists I have on roster per week).

I guess I have myself to blame a bit since I knew (and she as well) that it was cranked up pretty high (I could hear popping explosions occasionally which I took to be the hair follicle bulb and I do admit I was egging her on a bit with the intensity…) I pride myself on having a high pain tolerance and isn’t it true with electrolysis, no pain no gain? (You know, being able to feel the juice cranked up to really kill the hair?) I still feel like she’s really good since I can always feel the hair slide out and never plucked out and it feels like her technique is good and usually my skin calms itself after a few hours from being an angry pink color.

She treated the neck/chin this last time and it’s about the third day after the treatment and my neck/chin is breaking out! Small whiteheads and small hard pink pimples like I’m going through puberty again. What causes all this?!

Have I been over treated with some damage or is this an okay reaction for the chin/neck area and no permanent damage has occurred? I should tell her to turn down the intensity next time…BUT how can a prideful pain tolerant person like myself be able to tell when high is too high and low is too low???

#5

Oh Nevay! You are one Kiwi for sure. You guys! Off Steve Flaunty and the other kiwi guys went and I sat shaking in my harness — trying to go abseiling at Waitomo caves. Have you done that too? 100 meters straight down (hanging from a rope) into a black cave with a river at the bottom! Madonna Mia — not this Gumba! Consider that you are going to have your skin for the rest of your life. Take it a bit slower — what’s the big rush?

The lesson for the professional is to NOT always do what the patient wants. Many times I have said “you have had enough — go home for now.” When a patient comes to us, we are also protecting the patient from himself. It’s our job — you know, expert opinion. (Sadly, it’s often the upper lip that gets “fried” because the patient wants it done “yesterday.”)

#6

No, to your last question.

As long as she/they are not treating the same area or even close to it 2-3 times per week, then okay… BUT, there is no need to do this and I certainly would not encourage any client of mine to take this approach. I do however encourage the client to allow me to get a first, full clearance on facial hair asap, which typically translates into over an hour of work. I also encourage clearance at every session thereafter. For my transwomen, crossdressers and PCOS’ers, it is the norm to do a block appointment that lasts anywhere from 2-5 hours at a time. My mentor, James Walker the Seventh taught me how to do this well and I never miss an opprotunity to give him credit. He is truly the best electrologist IN THE WORLD. (That is why he shows off his world champion costume in all his posts. Well, there is another reason, but I don’t want to stir up trouble :mad:.)

Removing hair on the upper lip, for example, does not have to be confined to a maximum of a 20 - 30 minute appointment. If one has the right set up, skill and strategy, longer appointments are quite possible without scabbing, leakage and long term side effects. If an electrologist is not trained to do this, then it best not to go there, but just wanted to say, it is done and all turns out well in the immediate and the far future.

Special skin procedure machine gadjets are not needed afterwards, Nevay. Mega doses of vitamins are not needed, but normal doses are good to have with or without electrolysis. I would nip that idea. You should not have a lot of redness and pustules afterwards, so tell your electrologists baout your healing. Take a picture and show them. Do not touch the area afterwards with your hands as you have very tiny wounds that haven’t closed fully, so bacteria can be introduced into those wounds from the resident bacteria that is on all our hands even if we wash them. What you do AFTER you leave the office could be responsible for the pustules.

Did you get written aftercare instructions from your electrologist concerning aftercare and activites?

#7

Nope Michael, haven’t done that yet! But I’ve had some other crazy offers in the past which I politely declined! You’re so right about an electrologist not being a passive client pleaser and can assert authority for the clients own protection and I think that’s where my electrologist (who over treated my face) went wrong. She should have been the one in control and know her settings better. Well there is no big rush in the scheme of things but it’s the fact that the hair is on my face and I start uni next week! But again, it just occurred to me that it’s based on the fact that I wasn’t getting a full clearance each time.

I recently just saw this new electrologist (head of the NZL electrolysis association, so I think I found “the one”) and she had a look at my face and said I had some burns on my face and said “Frankly, if my electrolysis left me like this I’d be horrified…” However she was looking through a very magnified microscope like thing and no one has really noticed so far I think so I guess it could be worse…could be my upper lip!).

Her precision is pretty God-like and I hardly feel any pain when she does it and she’s like a dominatrix when it comes to asserting her seniority so I feel I can just lay back and relax with her and know I’m in good hands. And she does longer than 30min sessions so I think I can get full clearance every time I go in to see her which is fabulous. However, I did make quite a bad first impression by accidently kicking her tiny dog on the way in lol!..d’oh!

And NO I didn’t get written aftercare instructions from any electrolysis (this very new one might have but I dismissed it…? Can’t remember) But no one else has! I’ll ask for one next time if they have it. I guess only time heals wounds and using Tea tree oil, aloe vera and some Vitamin E cream religiously. Thanks guys :slight_smile:

#8

Since you are “down-under” do try some emu oil. (You may have to get it from that “other island” off to the left.) This is truly amazing (as you well know). If you try it, have your “kiwi zapper” show you how to put it on and not contaminate the bottle. This “blows everything else out of the water.” Read-up on how the native Aussies used it on burns. With emu oil, even a severe overtreatment will not develop crusts. Tons of information on-line.