Build ,hack or modify, machine?

Hair Removal Methods Do-It-Yourself Electrolysis
#1

I think I want to try to build
the http://www.geocities.com/hairfreethere/ version
has any one else attempted… any opinions

But was wondering about the other options like modifying a vector.
And was also curious if anyone ever modified any of the other type of machine I was looking at the emogi
on ebay it look like the tweezes plug in , wondering if anyone has ever alternated them with needle probe?

My sister and I are both full time students and cant afford to get professional treatments right now
so we wanted to start doing are legs and arms she was born a preemie so she had lanugo
( excessive fine body hair) … my whole family
always jokes that it never went away … I on the other hand have coarse but sparse hair on my legs

P.S. if anyone in the U.S.A is so unhappy with a vector or just wants to get rid of one
or any other old galvanic machine laying around I would
love to take it off your hands I can send you some $ through paypal for shipping
or I can also barter and design a small website (5 pages max )

#2

This might not be what you want to hear, but as an experienced DIY’er myself, this is my best advice:

Clearing legs is a pretty big project. Most people will stop at just the lower leg when they see the amount of time and effort it requires. And, this is regarding you have a pro operator with a good machine. With the device you are considering, this will take a large amount of your time, for many months, if not years.

You will make better progress with more time to study for your classes if you do this: get any job that allows you to work part time only one or half a day a week. Take the money to an electrologist that uses a good flash capable machine. Get an hour of professional electrology. The amount she clears successfully in that hour, combined with the time you spent working to pay for it, will be far more than you ever could with your home machine with the same time investmemt.

DIY’ing a small patch area is conceivable with a homemade instrument. On the other hand, for you and your sister to DIY large areas you’re going to need knowledge, practiced skill, optics, and a good machine.

Mantaray

#3

Your right not what I want to hear… but thank you for your opinion

But curious to why are your a d.I.y.'ers if you think the time is not worth it.
I guess thats another post … “How many of you are successful d.I.y.'ers
that are not professionals have results your happy with”

I’ve been researching for a while so I know it can take years
and sometimes a year and sometimes 9-months with a professional
I dont think $75 dollars of electrolysis is going to get me far… I’m sure over a year I
can get further with a couple times a weak for 30 -60 min. I really dont mind putting on some music
and zapping my leg hair sound’s fun plus take my mind of other things.
so no need to worry I’m not going to chug a keg at a party then try to set down and
clear my whole leg.

We do both work and have classes that goes to rent and tuition
we have very sporadic schedules but have free time we just would like to start the process
when I do have the extra cash I will go to a pro for my face.

I’m a mechanical engineer student
and have a couple certificates in machining so I know a lot about precision and patients.
my main goal is to go into medical device design.
As a hobby I like to build things just curious what’s the best way

I really just want to know besides the one touch what’s the next best thing
to build the device or modify one like the vector.

#4

Jred,
It is possible as stated to make your own machine. I am a professional, and I decided that I wanted to see how much difference there was between a homebrew and using galvanic on a professional machine. Basically, what I built was the schematic found at http://www.geocities.com/hairfreethere/ but with a few changes. I added a rotary switch with positions off, 9volts and 18volts. In the 9 volt position one 9 volt battery is used, while in the 18 volt position, two 9 volt batteries are connected in series. The Variable Resister is a Linear 10 Kohm Potentiometer. I purchased a foot switch online for about $10 that works wonderfully. I used a spare professional probe handle that I had around.
My findings were that indeed the units will work. The Current is not as well Regulated as my professional machine, and you will go through a lot of batteries.
Now for the main reason for my added change. After performing Galvanic, it is best to perform what is called Cataphoresis. This requires more current than is used for galvanic, as the current is applied to the surface of the skin and not inside the follicle. Professionals usually use a Stainless Steel Roller for this purpose, but that is not a requirement. A simple spoon with a wire attached can easily serve the same purpose. The other thing you need to know is that the spoon and the Ground connection swap for Cataphoresis. For galvanic, make certain that the ground terminal is the + lead and the probe connects to the - lead. But for Cataphoresis that reverses, and the Ground goes to the - lead and the spoon then would connect to the + lead. This serves to counter the lye buildup and make it inactive again. There are also some good lotions that one can apply to the skin before Cataphoresis and the action will help push the lotion into the skin.
The expense to build such a unit is very small and except for battery replacement, will last quite a while. But it is not going to be anything like one can get from a professional quality machine. My apilus uses 45 volts and a computerized current limiter to make sure it delivers just what I tell it too. The current on the homemade unit only has the dial and your skin resistance to limit its current.
You may have to make changes to your settings depending on the moisture content of your skin. But it is doable. Do not expect overnight results, but if you learn how to perform the electrolysis, the machine can work, but galvanic is very slow.

Martha Montgomery
Puget Sound Electrology

1 Like
#5

Mauh! MarthaJoy for the volts modification tip for Cataphoresis
I"ll let you know how it goes

I was reading http://www.susans.org/reference/electro/electrol.html
she was saying that over Cataphoresis can harden the skin
how do you know if your over doing it.

So can I do Anaphoresis before hand ? I saw one of your earlier post

http://www.hairtell.com/ubbthreads/showf…=true#Post37865
Anaphoresis uses the same negative lead as the probes does, but the currents range from generally .6ma to 2.0ma

Also thought I saw a post but cant find it something about putting a wet paper towel on the skin

While I’m gathering the supplies to build, I’ve been practicing with a One Touch its been about 48 hours I do have some red marks supposedly the norm hope not burn marks a little worried because I have a tawny complexion
so the most minor red marks like from a zit often leads to hyper-pigmentation .

Thing’s I’m was wondering

Now I know this probably why people have done the modification by adding the sponge so they dont come to close the anode before hand but just incase is of any concern.
3.My leg skin omits Lye about 5 sec after inserting the probe at the lowest setting
a. Am I making a mistake is the needle to hot to shallow for am I burning myself by doing the recommended 15 sec
b. Should I still proceed the 15 sec or remove the stylist right away … Has anyone else had this
happens or do i just go by when the hair slides out.
4. Dose water tension in the legs factor which I have (haven’t tried other parts of the body)
5. Can I use cocobutter or vitamin E right after or should I make tend-skin which is better
to prevent scaring

Thank You for the help
Jamie

#6

Jamie;

>I was reading http://www.susans.org/reference/electro/electrol.html
she was saying that over Cataphoresis can harden the skin
how do you know if your over doing it.

Yes, Cataphoresis can harden skin, The point is to not overdo it. Cataphoresis should not hurt, and many find it comforting. Its purpose is to reverse the process used to make the lye. It also helps contract the blood vessels helping to reduce the redness of the skin. I use a moisturizing cream from Dectro that is designed for Cataphoresis called yi zi Balm, but not sure of the spelling. It does help and has an antibiotic ingredient as well. Cataphoresis helps to push this cream into the skin cells where it can best perform it job.

So can I do Anaphoresis before hand ? I saw one of your earlier post

Anaphoresis, can be performed, but many find it very irritating. It will cause redness and enlarges the blood vessels, but can make it easier to insert the probes as well. You can try it if you like.

> Quote:
>http://www.hairtell.com/ubbthreads/showf…=true#Post37865
Anaphoresis uses the same negative lead as the probes does, but the currents range from generally .6ma to 2.0ma

>Also thought I saw a post but cant find it something about putting a wet paper towel on the skin

The wet paper towel trick was used at the Electrology school that I went to. I believe the reasoning was because the roller had plastic handles and could therefore not be place in the sterilizer. So by placing a wet paper towel between the patron and the roller, skin contact was not made and sterilization was not necessary. The wet paper towel was just a means of providing continuity for the current while not placing the roller directly on the skin. I have several different attachments to my professional cataphoresis probe and only one of which is a roller, others are different shapes for different areas of the skin like balls for eyelashes etc. For home use, just a spoon should work well and is very cheap.

>While I’m gathering the supplies to build, I’ve been practicing with a One Touch its been about 48 hours I do have some red marks supposedly the norm hope not burn marks a little worried because I have a tawny complexion
so the most minor red marks like from a zit often leads to hyper-pigmentation .

I have not used or even seen the One Touch, so I cannot offer much on its operation. I believe I read somewhere that you push a button to operate the one touch. Current should not be on when inserting or removing the probe from the follicle. Only when it is fully inserted should it be activated.

>Thing’s I’m was wondering

>Now I know this probably why people have done the modification by adding the sponge so they don’t come to close the anode before hand but just encase is of any concern.

The purpose of the sponge is to provide good electrical connection to the body. Salted water is a very good conductor. I add some table salt to tap water for my sponges for just that reason.

>3.My leg skin omits Lye about 5 sec after inserting the probe at the lowest setting

Mind you I have not used Galvanic all that much, having concentrated on Flash, Thermolysis and Blend. But I have experimented with it a little and I get to where I see an effect at about 5 seconds time as well.

>a. Am I making a mistake is the needle to hot to shallow for am I burning myself by doing the recommended 15 sec

First off, the probes does not get hot. Maybe you are referring to too much current. I would work first on areas that are not visible to others and see how the skin reacts.
Multigalvanic machines are regulated to just 0.2ma but allow 2-3 minutes per hair. 15 seconds seems extremely fast to me. For Galvanic many actually leave the probe in for several seconds after removing the hair, just to make sure they produced enough lye.

>b. Should I still proceed the 15 sec or remove the stylist right away … Has anyone else had this
happens or do i just go by when the hair slides out.

Again, make sure unit is off before removing probe. Yes the hair should slide out easily, as if you have to tweeze the hair to remove it, that is all you have done.

  1. Dose water tension in the legs factor which I have (haven’t tried other parts of the body)
  2. Can I use cocobutter or vitamin E right after or should I make tend-skin which is better
    to prevent scaring

I am afraid I do not have experience with those items. Witch Hazel is another after care item that has been used, but I prefer my moisturizer that I mentioned above.

Martha Montgomery
Puget Sound Electrology

#7

Jamie,

Seeing lye at 5 seconds at the lowest setting does sound pretty fast. Either the hairs you’re working on respond very quickly or the dial is not working (or you’re using it at the highest setting accidentally). But if it’s not hurting, then you can continue to use it at that setting.

The tricky part is to learn how long to apply the current. The 15 seconds is just a guideline and it will vary quite a bit depending on the dial setting, the size and depth of the hair you’re treating, and your current body moisture content. Each hair is a learning experience. You need only apply current for the minimum amount of time that will allow the hair to release easily. It may be 5 seconds or 60 seconds depending on all the parameters mentioned.

The “Switch” on the One Touch is to contact the metal band on the stylus with your salty finger. Not a very efficient method and the salt gets messy as the water runs down into the treatment area. My sponge suggestion modification (where you run a wire from the band to a salty sponge on the floor) is to allow the mess to be relocated away from the treatment area and allow a more definite On/Off procedure. This prevents accidentally switching ON prematurely, which can create problems and scarring.

I am a successful DIY’er. 9 months is generally going to be the completion of any treatment because that’s about how long it takes for all the hairs to go through their growth cycles. After 9 months and an hour or two per week, I removed every arm pit hair permanently.

You can certainly do this on your legs, but it will take you longer than 9 months just because you are going after so many hairs. You may average one hair per minute. Guess how many hairs you have on your legs, how much time per week you want to play at this, and you’ll be able to calculate how long it’s going to take. Then figure you’re going to get less than 100% kill rate (I have been getting about 90% with Galvanic if done right). You’re probably looking at a couple of years of persistent work. If this is just free time that you’d be laying back listening to music, then it’s time that has been used productively. However, if the mission is to clear as quickly and efficiently as possible, then working a job for the money to then let a pro do it much quicker is why you get that recommendation.

If you have the ability to build things, then I’d highly recommed you make your own unit. It’s very simple and the main advantage is that you can use professional probes rather than the fragile and cumbersome one that comes with the One Touch. The Vector is basically the same guts inside, just $200 more to avoid some simple assembly.

#8

It’s easy enough to build. You might want to get a soldering iron and learn how to use it for this, as it makes the built unit a LOT sturdier.

Cost for non-electrolysis-specific parts is about $20.
A soldering iron plus rosin-core solder plus a stand will run about $30 at Radio Shack, and you can use it for other things later… I got a laptop from someone that had a loose power connection and was flaky, but not any more. =)

The Vector is a scam item; it does not permanently remove hair. It works as well as normal tweezers. Hair does not conduct electricity to any appreciable amount; therefore, no current can be delivered to the root of the hair (where the hair grows).

On a theoretical level, I’ve thought about how to combine a tweezers (is that the singular?) with a probe, to make the work go faster, but I haven’t thought of or daydreamed a good way to do it yet.

#9

Does higher voltage give any advantages?

Is the Cataphoresis process neccessary (what kind of skin damage can I get if I don’t do this process)?

#10

Cataphoresis is valuable in nullifying the excess lye and jump starting the healing process. You may skip it, however, you will have less excess chemical burn and faster skin healing if you use it.

In the interest of fairness even to the devil, Vector machines can be modified to allow real hair removal to happen, but it is less expensive to build your own, than to buy a Vector and then modify it. Unless you stumble over a used one for $20 or less at a garage sale, it is just not a cost effective purchase. Even then, you will need that $30 soldering iron, as they have been known to be very poorly soldered and tend to develope broken connections very easily.

#11

Thank you James for the information.

I plan on building a very similar machine to the one NoHair (kudos to you!) made on his webpage as well.

Just wondering when you measure current, are you measuring with your body or just the circuit alone?

What is the typical current range (max/min) for both Cataphoresis and Electrolysis?

#12

Mulan5000;
The current would be with the body as well as the circuit regulation.
For Galvanic electrolysis, the minimum would be about 0.200 ma. For faster galvanic action, many go to as high as 0.800 ma.

For Cataphoresis, generally you need 0.600 to 2.000 ma

Remember that the polarities are different. NoHair’s circuit can be modified to use a higher voltage like 18vdc (2-9v batteries in series) for the cataphoresis part.

I hope these numbers help you. My Clareblend epilator uses 15 volts for cataphoresis, but it is not as well regulated as my Apilus which uses 45 vdc and is very precise. But then it has much better electronic circuitry than the Clareblend.

For a utensil for cataphoresis you can get by very simply with using a spoon vs having to by a roller.

#13

Marthajoy, how would you determine you are applying say 0.500 mA to the follicle? Or is there some way to measure the resistance between the sponge and area you are doing the epilation?

My idea was to use voltage regulators and that would probably lower the voltage to 7 or 6 vdc which means I would need a different potentiometer and maybe add resistors to get the right current ranges.

Thanks for all the current ranges and the spoon idea.

#14

You can put a meter in series with the probe, and the meter will indicate how much current is flowin. I personally prefer the analog meters for this, as the response time is more rapid. But a digital meter will work as well, it just does not respond to changes in the current as quickly.

What professional machines do, is to use current regulation rather than voltage regulation. That way if the resistance changes, the current stays the same. With voltage regulation, if the resistance drops the current jumps, and if the resistance increases, the current drops below what is needed for epilation. If you had an adjustable voltage regulator, you could just use the potentiometer to increase the voltage until you get the current that you need. There are many ways to make a galvanic epilator that will work. The differences relate to ease of use and safety concerns.
My apilus epilator uses about 45 volts, but because it is very strongly current regulated, you can be certain that no mater what resistance it encounters, the current is going to be whatever it is set to deliver. Where as with lower voltages, the regulation is not as good, and some variances can happen. On my clareblend epilator which uses 15vdc, you can actually see the galvanic meter fluctuate with changes in resistance of the connection.
Yes, they both work for what is required, but as a professional, I like knowing that my equipment is performing as it should.

#15

Hi Redj, I am an electronics engineer and enjoy designing and building all sorts of equipments. A while ago, I desided to investigate around hair removal methods and desided to build high standard and affordable Electrolysis machines.
I started with the galvanic and moving towards Thermolysis and Blend too.
The Galvanic is almost done and here is the specifications:

-Output current: 0.05mA…1mA (.05mA
steps)
-Timer: 1 Seconds…99 Seconds (1 S steps)
-Automatic Timer/Manual timing modes.
-Capable of monitoring Unit of Lye (UL)
-Optional beeping to help counting time.
without looking at the LCD display.
-Pedal/Handpiece control option
-Comact and portable design.
-Affordable price

Have you managed to finish your project?

#16

By the way, my machine has a current regulator inside and therefore the user won’t need to be worried about fluctuations .

#17

Here is a photo of not yet finished machine:
Any idea would be much appreciated.

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