Regarding the issue of joules and fluence. The measurements on the laser are in joules fluence not joules. So 20 joules fluence takes into account the spot size. So 20 joules fluence at 15 mm is the same as 20 joules fluence at 18 mm spot. The joules are different but the joules fluence are the same. This can be confusing but the numbers used in the machines are joules fluence.
Now why spot size does matter. If our target was the surface of the skin, then spot size wouldn’t matter but our target lies well below the skin surface, deep into the dermis. The depth of effective penetration ends up being a function of the spot size (not unlike the volume to surface area relationship as the pulse penetrates the skin). And the deeper the hair the more important the spot size.
Thanks, sslhr and lagirl. I learned something–but my calculation for joules-fluence was at least correct. I’m going to need to read up about the physics governing the relationship between spot size and penetration.
My appointment is in a few days. If something exciting happens to my skin I’ll post pictures, otherwise I’ll wait until I shed. Actually, if you guys suggest a duration for photos I’ll do my best to provide them.
LOL BRYCE me and u have the exact same body hair lol t-shirt…
i finished my 2nd session 2 weeks ago am still very confused about the whole process believe me its a rollercoaster but i keep hearing u cant expect anything until the 4th-5th session so i guess remaining optimistic is a must…
bryce, the best pictures are right before each treatment before the area is shaved and then 4 weeks after to see what it looks like after shedding. thanks for updating us on your story.
norbit, you should be seeing results after each treatment. you should shed and have less and less hair coming back in each time. by treatment 5, you should be seeing a significant difference.
Dang guys, I’m really disappointed. I called in to ask a question before my appointment today and found out that there was some scheduling snafu that’s caused me to be pushed off until a later date. Moreover, the doctor wants to do a third test spot (at 16J and 18J @ 15mm) to test for pigmentation before he even does the first treatment at 14J. So now I’m going back in late July for that, and probably won’t be able to get my first session in until early September.
Oh well, at least I’ll earn the interest on the money I’ve saved for this.
can you ask him to do several test spots, including several at 18mm? considering your skin type, you shouldn’t have issues being treated at 16 joules 18mm. I’ve done up to max 20j on 18mm and 30j on 15mm without any issues and I’m between types II and III.
Well, this experiment has taken an unexpected turn! Upon my third consultation, the doc was about to try test spots at a range of higher settings when he claimed to see hyperpigmentation from the last run of test spots. Therefore, he elected not to treat me and suggested I try a different modality.
I think he was looking for an out and I let him have it. There was pigmentation but it was slight. I made it clear I wanted a good reduction and was going to want the settings bumped as soon as possible. He probably figured there was too much risk and I was being too aggressive for his tastes. Anyway, for the same amount of money as 4-6 treatments I can get a pretty huge 100% guaranteed reduction with electrolysis. I’ll go with the sure thing.
Check out posts by “Chuck” to get an idea of how much you can get done with that amount of money. You should go for it, but have correct expectations so you won’t be disappointed. That’s a large area to treat one hair at a time. Concentrate on getting your first clearance as fast as possible first.
Do keep in mind that the back is not a large area for an electrologist that is proficient and aggressive with microflash thermolysis. On a particular client of mine who was covered from neck to beltline, shoulders and upper arms this time last year, we are now at month 13 and he was cleared today of all the sporadic hairs in all the areas mentioned for a total of 1,893 insertions done in 2.5 hours. I will see him in two weeks for more maintenance and those insertion numbers will steadily fall at this point onward. He’s just about finished. Haven’t updated the cost for awhile, but I’m guessing we are around $4,000?
I’m not special. Other electrologists are capable of doing the same thing if they so desire.
Thanks Dee. That should give bryce a good idea of cost. 4 laser treatments in his case were probably around $1200-1400 total I’m guessing. So it’s a significant difference from $4,000 over a year, and I think he should have correct expectations. That’s why I brought it up.
If laser works on bryce’s back in four treatments, then that obviously would be a better deal. I agree that expectations have to be realistic with this hair removal/reduction business, and to keep expectations real, people who know about the process have to be very honest and straight forward with the confused consumer. With all the variables, hurdles and obstacles involved with this hair removal maze, it is still not always easy to answer questions with an individual slant. Chuck’s situation is what it is. His electrologist offers what she can for him and is most likely unlike the electrologist that is located 10 miles away. One may be faster than the other and more skilled and we all know that that, can translate into bottom line cost ond success when the story is over.